Do you think p4p girls are crazy for doing what they do?

[lavezzi]

I just wanted to get your opinions on something - Do you think women who sell their bodies are crazy for doing so? I'm not talking about women from poor countries like Thailand or the Philippines who are forced into it, I'm talking about for example women from Romania who by EU regulations are free to travel into countries like Ireland to work, except instead of working in McDonalds for €8 an hour, they choose to offer full services to random men for €100-€200 per hour. Keep in mind the punter I observed last week, who's probably fairly typical of many men who pay for sex:

This guy was 160cm tall, weighed 200kg and had the face of a diseased fish, no exaggeration.

I personally think they're crazy for doing it. The whole scenario just seems f***ed up to me; random men of all ages coming in and out of your room every day to have sex with you. It's also pretty dangerous health-wise and in terms of safety, seeing as oral sex without protection and operating out of a private location are standard procedures. The huge pay for short hours is obviously the sole reason so many women here are doing it, but I personally don't place much value in money which I don't need and I'm happy enough to survive on the bare minimum.

Do you think you'd do it if you were a woman? If any of the few women who frequent this forum see this thread please contribute also.

[FREEDOM1]

Not all prostitues work in the conditions that you describe?
which country are you in?
In australia, only safe sex is allowed, the women have regulare checks
and the industry seems to be well regulated and professional
i dont think its fair to judge these women without knowing their circumstances
you dont know what ther lives are like and they may really have very little
other choice if they have little or no education
I think you are abit naive on this issue, not every man who goes to visist
these ladies is 160cm and 200kg, in fact i see very few men in society that fit
that description, men of all ages and incomes go to prostitutes
It seems like you have a big issue with this? people who get their knickers in a twist
over prostitution are ignorant and have an agends
people have sex all the time, so whats the diference if you pay for it
so what - it actually saves alot of time and energy trying to pick up a chick
and who knows if she will even put or be any good?
if you go to the pros's , you wil lfind one that you like and does almost anything you
want - no dineer, chatting aor stupid bullshot gamesetc...
i appreciate what these women do and they offer a valuable service

[Rock]

From the woman's point of view, it might make a lot of sense, especially if her options are limited to minimum wage type of work. She can slave away most of her waking hours at McDonalds just to survive. Or she can create a personal escort clientele which generates enough income for her to build up an asset base which in turn will will generate passive income and help support her for the rest of her life. The real golden years for such work are between 18-30. Financially, it makes sense for her to use her youth and beauty to either snag a well-off to wealthy guy and get him to marry her or else to get paid for it (her yought and beauty) by the hour as long as it lasts. If she instead worked hard at some dead-end chump change job, she would probably age more quickly and before she knew it, arrive at 30 looking over the hill.

As for the clientele, in many forms of this type of work, women are allowed to pick-and-choose. When I worked for my last company, my Korean boss would sometimes take the boys out to a KTV for some 'fun'. Most of the clientele I saw in these places were mid-20s to late 30s guys who were generally attractive and successful. Older guys seem to have less motivation to go to such places as their sex drive wanes. And the girls were making big money without even having to do too much most of the time.

In Thailand, I see a full range of western mongers - from the guys who look under 18 to the geriatrics, handsome and in-shape guys with kick-boxer phsiques to totally gross. Generally the hard bangers are very young and sometimes frusrate the girls by saying they shouldn't have to pay or trying to get by just buying drinks. Really old men often are just buying some companionship and perhaps a bit if affection. Middle age guys are all over the map but tend to be more generous. Again, in many cases, the girls get to choose and they often do. Those who work in venues where no choice is allowed choose to work in such venues in the first place. I don't think its generally as bad as you imagine for the girls who are smart enough to create their own boundaries, avoid substance abuse, and save and invest the money they make while still young.

[djfourmoney]

From a moral point of view it might seem short-sighted and crazy. But from a pure economics point of you, can you find a job for $100-200 an hour and work on average 4-6 hours? On one of the sites I frequent there are prostitutes that are regular posters. I say the average of $100-200 an hour for four hours based on the fact that some days they take off, other days are slow and other days are overbooked.

Its a very expensive business because you're asset is your body/face. You can have two business models: Multiple Repeats or Constant New Customers. The former usually is the type that provides GFE, PSE or at least close to it. The latter, well this is the provider most people complain about as being rushed and not into it very much.

The latter usually burns out quickly and has other issues. The former usually have long careers, marry a "John" or some other guy and quit. Some move into porn of course.

Many Porn Stars have moved into escorting. You might think that's crazy when you can earn $1,500 a shoot, why would you want to have sex with a random fan?

But they do it.

Its a great way to put yourself through school, Alisha Klass paid for her classes at UCLA with porn money. She's not the only one, many do it. You can also invest it like Xaviera Hollander, write books about your experiences, write columns (Penthouse) and buy property (she owns a B&B).

As long as Civilian women make it hard to get laid, as long as a wife doesn't give blow jobs or take it anally, there will always be a places for the World's Oldest Profession and one might say most profitable business, of course only where its legal does anybody keep tax records, but its safe to say its a Billion dollar industry.

[travelingjohn69]

I just wanted to get your opinions on something - Do you think women who sell their bodies are crazy for doing so? I'm not talking about women from poor countries like Thailand or the Philippines who are forced into it, I'm talking about for example women from Romania who by EU regulations are free to travel into countries like Ireland to work, except instead of working in McDonalds for €8 an hour, they choose to offer full services to random men for €100-€200 per hour. Keep in mind the punter I observed last week, who's probably fairly typical of many men who pay for sex:

This guy was 160cm tall, weighed 200kg and had the face of a diseased fish, no exaggeration.

I personally think they're crazy for doing it. The whole scenario just seems f***ed up to me; random men of all ages coming in and out of your room every day to have sex with you. It's also pretty dangerous health-wise and in terms of safety, seeing as oral sex without protection and operating out of a private location are standard procedures. The huge pay for short hours is obviously the sole reason so many women here are doing it, but I personally don't place much value in money which I don't need and I'm happy enough to survive on the bare minimum.

Do you think you'd do it if you were a woman? If any of the few women who frequent this forum see this thread please contribute also.

Are you putting any money in there pocket or are you criticizing them. If you feel they are doing something wrong put your money where your mouth is. I challenge you give every single hooker out there $100 dollars per-day. What's crazier, a woman being upfront about her price, or a woman that marries you has your kids and runs to the courts to take you for everything you're worth?

[PeterAndrewNolan]

lavezzi,
marriage is just a "respected" form of prostitution.

Women trade sex for resources. Try reading maggies blog.

http://maggiemcneill.wordpress.com/

Marriage is the MOST EXPENSIVE form of prostitution for a man.

[NorthAmericanguy]

Not all prostitues work in the conditions that you describe?
which country are you in?
In australia, only safe sex is allowed, the women have regulare checks
and the industry seems to be well regulated and professional
i dont think its fair to judge these women without knowing their circumstances
you dont know what ther lives are like and they may really have very little
other choice if they have little or no education
I think you are abit naive on this issue, not every man who goes to visist
these ladies is 160cm and 200kg, in fact i see very few men in society that fit
that description, men of all ages and incomes go to prostitutes
It seems like you have a big issue with this? people who get their knickers in a twist
over prostitution are ignorant and have an agends
people have sex all the time, so whats the diference if you pay for it
so what - it actually saves alot of time and energy trying to pick up a chick
and who knows if she will even put or be any good?
if you go to the pros's , you wil lfind one that you like and does almost anything you
want - no dineer, chatting aor stupid bullshot gamesetc...
i appreciate what these women do and they offer a valuable service

+1

[NorthAmericanguy]

lavezzi,
marriage is just a "respected" form of prostitution.

Women trade sex for resources. Try reading maggies blog.

http://maggiemcneill.wordpress.com/

Marriage is the MOST EXPENSIVE form of prostitution for a man.

SPOT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PeterAndrewNolan]

SPOT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you. I do try to educate the lads.

[NorthAmericanguy]

I personally think they're crazy for doing it. The whole scenario just seems f***ed up to me; random men of all ages coming in and out of your room every day to have sex with you. It's also pretty dangerous health-wise and in terms of safety, seeing as oral sex without protection and operating out of a private location are standard procedures.

There is really no difference with dealing with your local bar girl who is at the clubs/bars every weekend going home with different men. At the very least, the prostitute is the smarter one because she gets paid for her services and usually they are more aware of STD's and get some type of routine check ups.

The huge pay for short hours is obviously the sole reason so many women here are doing it

The list of reasons are endless. Some women are lazy. Some women can't hold down normal jobs. Some women are just not smart enough to land a good job. Many women ARE forced or tricked into it. And some women actually like doing the job and look at it as preforming a therapeutic value.

[Repatriate]

From the woman's point of view, it might make a lot of sense, especially if her options are limited to minimum wage type of work. She can slave away most of her waking hours at McDonalds just to survive. Or she can create a personal escort clientele which generates enough income for her to build up an asset base which in turn will will generate passive income and help support her for the rest of her life. The real golden years for such work are between 18-30. Financially, it makes sense for her to use her youth and beauty to either snag a well-off to wealthy guy and get him to marry her or else to get paid for it (her yought and beauty) by the hour as long as it lasts. If she instead worked hard at some dead-end chump change job, she would probably age more quickly and before she knew it, arrive at 30 looking over the hill.

As for the clientele, in many forms of this type of work, women are allowed to pick-and-choose. When I worked for my last company, my Korean boss would sometimes take the boys out to a KTV for some 'fun'. Most of the clientele I saw in these places were mid-20s to late 30s guys who were generally attractive and successful. Older guys seem to have less motivation to go to such places as their sex drive wanes. And the girls were making big money without even having to do too much most of the time.

It makes perfect sense from an economic point of view in a country like Thailand where average wages for new non connected Thai grads top out at 10,000-15,000 baht a month for years of dull draining work. Thailand tends to be a very socially and morally ambiguous and duplicitous culture when it comes to their own mores. They think promiscuity, lying, and cheating is bad yet it's done frequently by your average Thai without real moral compunction or as long as you maintain outward face it's alright to do these things. Real ethical standards of behavior where you do "the right thing" without doing it for the benefit of face or monetary gain almost doesn't exist.

Prostitutes and the like are considered very low on the social tier in Thailand yet some of them are genuinely beautiful looking women. Once they "quit" their stint they can retire with a decent amount of money if they are smart and Thais will tend to look beyond how they earned their initial windfall. Some of the less hardcore girls work at Spas where they only have sex on a case by case basis unlike Go Go's or Massage Parlors. They try to hook up with a long time suitor who they can milk indefinitely. That's where the whole sponsorship thing comes into play.

You're right about the MP/Karaoke club clientele it's almost considered a right of passage and daily office thing if you work for an asian company. Some Singaporean guys told me that their expense accounts even take into account these things. I don't think it's a big deal it sure beats the western version of going to a bar after work to get drunk, hang out with a bunch of guys, and watch sports. The NE Asian model for office relaxation is highly progressive IMO.

[Repatriate]

The list of reasons are endless. Some women are lazy. Some women can't hold down normal jobs. Some women are just not smart enough to land a good job. Many women ARE forced or tricked into it. And some women actually like doing the job and look at it as preforming a therapeutic value.

It's really no big deal. I think women who involve themselves in the lifestyle will ruin themselves though. By that I mean the drugs, partying, clubs, douchebag boyfriends etc.. that easy money tends to lead to. The smart ones count their sheckels and end up lying low afterward and marry an unsuspecting man who they can start a post-career life with.

[NorthAmericanguy]

Hay guys, I think you all should listen to this interview. It's an interview with the late DC Madam. This lady is SMART, she goes into prostitution as well as s few other things.



http://radicalvixen.com/blog/audio/DcMadam.mp3

[djfourmoney]

SPOT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you. I do try to educate the lads.

If your cynical then YES Marriage could be manipulated to look like legalized prostitution. Or on Jeopardy! "What is a bitter divorced man"?

How come divorced men say similar things? I can't find the link but there was a good piece on CNN not too long ago.

Look Peter the problem is NOT you or the institution of marriage, its Feminism and what its done overall. Its liberalized divorce, making it easy to get and social shame is almost non-existent. Its the welfare state and its relationship to women who are under no pressure really to marry anybody BUT the ideal partner.

How do you combat this? You don't say marriage is bad, you don't say Government is the problem.

Women are already activity trying to remove men from the equation of child birth. Advances in reproductive science combined with men giving away their sperm for a few dollars or for narcissistic reasons is leading to women who myopically believe there are no good men available for them, when its clearly the choices they make. They are opting for IVF and this is picking up steam in the UK where the Government clearly sees no problem with single parent households when it believes income is the sole solution.

The ONLY way out of this is to marry foreign women. If you don't want to get married or in your case re-married, then fine but don't impose your view that marriage is bad based on your personal experience when its never a 1:1 comparison between one person and another.

I see this as White Men being upset they have lost control over their women. Well WE as men ALLOWED IT! We dismissed it and scoffed at it -

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ReTAvNN ... r_embedded[/youtube]

The woman's movement was inclusive during this key period (Black, White, Asian, Latino), while White Men in the UK and US were too busy trying to oppress Black Men. That's why its almost hard for me to have any sympathy because you were focused on things that have no barring on quality of life, too busy trying to keep "the other" out of your neighborhood, your stores, schools and social events. White Women were busy f***ing Black Men behind your back, some even marrying them. Keeping races apart was and will NEVER WORK. Its easier with oppression and religion but without say the fight between Christianity and Islam, nobody has had any luck keeping ethic groups apart for foolish reasons, the US found this out quickly in Iraq...

Since women are the majority voters in most Western Countries, guess what Government your going to get? One that kowtows to WOMEN. Like this shit is shocking or something.

They have no problem sending your ass to war either, how many men has Thatcher killed? How about Madeleine Albright?

Strong Families scare Governments because men have something to fight for. What in the hell does a single man have to fight for but largely SELFISH REASONS?

Women have successfully turned all men into possible pedophiles to protect not OUR children but THEIR children.

I am really concerned over some of these views in the Men's Rights Movement because it speaks of scorched earth policy. Either women will marry us men or we'll all perish.

Most of you are not doing the work of humanity in sciences and biology so basically in my view, statements like Marriage Sucks is completely useless in a debate that we've already lost but you don't wanna fight fire with fire. You think women give a f**k if your some outspoken SINGLE Male? They'll just call you a bitter divorced man who can't get laid because he's so bitter.

Don't believe me? How come Ann Romney was able to successfully deflect the truth about her being a woman of privilege, marrying a man of privilege? Meaning she's never had to deal with the typical Americans have to deal with, especially single parents. She is married, while her attacker originally is a lesbian single parent herself.

A woman with or without children, or married can be outspoken. You do that shit and guess what? You're called a woman hater or you have something against marriage or against married women.

Advice, stop marrying the wrong women, its that easy. If they don't jump out in front of a truck or bullet for you, their WORTHLESS in a relationship.

[PeterAndrewNolan]

djfourmoney,
actually I disagree with some of what you wrote and agree with most of what you wrote.

The problem is not feminism in my opinion. The problem is FATHERS. Every woman who screwed a man over in divorce has a FATHER WHO ALLOWED IT. In my case, Bill Toal. I have suggested to men they might like to call Bill Toal +61 2 69 25 40 41 in Australia and ask him why he allowed, indeed provided MONEY for his daughter to commit crimes. It is a very valid question. Jennifer Toal www.jenninolan.com was ONLY able to commit crimes because her FATHER gave her money to do so.

He was 65 at the time and he was out in the hot sun in Wagga washing cars to pay Jennifer Lawyers. When what he SHOULD have done if he were a REAL MAN was to tell her that perjury is a crime and that she needed to make remedy for that crime and give her no support.

So the problem is squarely with FATHERS and NO ONE ELSE.

Sure. We might argue that women committed crimes and we might argue that women should be held accountable for their criminal acts. But the ONLY people who are going to hold them accountable for those criminal acts are FATHERS and that is why I created www.crimesagainstfathers.com.

As far as marrying the wrong women...they are ALL the wrong women to marry. My first book proposed the future of marriage. That is the marriage contract along with the arbitration panel. So the remedy is available for any man who wishes it. Any man in the english speaking world can, today, rescind his marriage contract with the guvment, sign up a marriage agreement with his wife if that is what they both want, and then later resolve any disputes via the arbitration panel.

I have given men the remedy to the criminal family law courts. Men do not want to use that remedy. Not my problem to make them. They have a choice.

http://www.mensbusinessassociation.com/ ... fault.aspx
http://www.mensbusinessassociation.com/ ... fault.aspx
http://www.mensbusinessassociation.com/ ... fault.aspx

Marriage is just "respected prostitution" no matter HOW you look at it. To try on these bullshit arguments of the "value" women bring to a marriage is just that. Bullshit arguments. Women bring the ability to have babies to a marriage. Thats the only thing women do that men can not do for themselves. If men ever get their act together on surrogacy like Ronaldo did then women will be out of luck.

I had a woman in my house for 20 years and now no woman in my house for 4 years. I have no idea how I lived in a house with a woman for 20 years given all the compromises I had to make to do that. Marriage sucks for a man. And even having said that I would still like my fav#1 to change her mind about kids and I would like to be with her in the future...maybe even marry her....yep...I AM THAT STUPID!!!

But if we marry it will be via the type of marriage agreement above....and spanking for being naughty will be on it! LOL!!