How do normal men find wives or girlfriends in America?

[Winston]

I have a curious question: How do NORMAL men find girlfriends and wives in America? I know that sounds like a stupid question. But let me explain why I'm asking it. Consider the following ways that you are supposed to, or expected to, meet women in America:

1. Public places: Out in public, you are not supposed to talk to strangers unless it's business related. So you can't go out and meet people as if you were shopping at Walmart or something. Out in public, you are supposed to mind your own business and leave others alone to mind their business too. Communication is only for business related purposes only. Otherwise, you aren't supposed to bother people. You are only supposed to socialize at parties, group outings, picnics and get togethers, if you're invited to one that is. The only people that like to talk to strangers in America are older men who are lonely and want someone to talk to, or elderly people who have nothing to do. But not young women, no way, they are the most averse to talking to strangers.

2. Work environment. At work, you are not supposed to date a coworker unless she has a strong interest in you. But office ladies tend to be fat, old and ugly. You're not gonna meet decent looking women in offices usually. And even if there are attractive women in offices, they are usually taken or too busy to go out (or so they say) or not looking or "working on themselves" (whatever that means) or you aren't their type so they make excuses not to date you, etc. And even if you do like a girl at work, you aren't allowed to flirt with her or pursue her or court her or seduce her, unless she makes it clear that she's interested in you of course. Otherwise, you will come across as a creep who is violating her boundaries and behaving inappropriately at work. And if she complains to the manager, you could lose your job too or be seriously reprimanded. Basically, you aren't allowed to pursue or court women unless they like you first. So if none of the women signal an interest, you are powerless to do anything about it.

3. High school/College environment. In college, the girls are there just to study and you are only supposed to talk to them about school related stuff. If you try to socialize with them, you are seen as an annoying distraction who is deviating from their aim there, which is to study and get a degree so they can graduate and get a good job and career. To female students, college is there for them to study, not play. So you aren't supposed to socialize with the girls there or try to befriend them. The best chance you have is befriending foreign girls at the college, the ones who just arrived to America and are not yet Americanized. They will usually be more friendly and sweet and not have an attitude. You can also try joining a college fraternity to have a social life and be invited to parties. But then you have to conform to the group of guys there, be an extrovert, be group oriented, and go through all the BS initiation rituals to be a member of the frat group, and pledge your loyalty as well. Frankly, I've never understood the mythos around college having a wild social life. I never saw evidence of that even though I looked for it everyday.

4. Extracurricular groups and activities. You can join extracurricular groups and activities to meet people, such as take Yoga classes, join hiking clubs like the Sierra Club, take cooking classes, take swing dance or salsa dance classes, or go to groups on Meetup.com, etc. But most of the people you meet there will be mere acquaintances or casual friends. It's easy to develop superficial friendships like that, but they usually don't go anywhere. And the women there will not be any less picky, if you aren't their type, they will simply friendzone you. Meeting women is no guarantee of anything. As we all know, nearly every girl in America claims to be taken or have a boyfriend/husband (even if she's single, she still says that to blow you off politely). If you are lucky, maybe you will meet a good girl to date through such venues, but you have to be favored by destiny. You have to cross your fingers and hope that the law of attraction, aka "like attracts like", will draw someone compatible to you. Regardless, this seems to be the best way to be socially active and meet people at the same time. But it doesn't necessarily lead to romance. And most men do not join such things.

5. Social groups/cliques. As we all know, social life in the US is confined within cliques and groups of familiar friends who hang out. But not outside of them, since people don't talk to strangers unless it's business-related. But social cliques are exclusive, not inclusive, so to try to break into one is like trying to break down a wall that's designed to keep you out. It's very awkward and unnatural to say the least. However, even if you do break into a social clique, there's no guarantee that you will like the girls in it or that the girls will like you. If you aren't their type, they will still friendzone you. As in any group, the girls tend to be drawn toward the "alpha males" of the group, or those who are the most dominant and charismatic in the clique. But this is assuming that there are even girls in your social clique of course, since some groups of friends are all guys and have no girls in them. However, even if there are girls in your social clique, there are usually MORE guys than girls in most social cliques, so there aren't enough girls to go around. This means that the numbers don't work in your favor either.

6. Bars and clubs. Bars in America are usually full of men, blue collar types or redneck types. If there are women there, they are usually surrounded by lots of guys hogging for their attention. Women don't go to bars alone, contrary to what you see in the movies. In nightclubs, there are many college girls yeah, but they are usually young, and plus, they go there to hang out with friends and show off their bodies, not to meet guys. You have to be a hot guy to get their attention, otherwise you don't exist. So I see no basis for the mythos that bars and clubs are a way to meet people. I've been to nightclubs and every time, I see that people go there to hang out with their friends, not to meet people.

7. Online dating. As we all know, online dating totally sucks in America. Most guys who try it get zero responses, no matter how many women they write. And even when they do get responses, it's usually from flaky girls who are just taunting and teasing them to get a reaction or to get attention and are not serious about meeting up for a date. Occasionally, you get responses from girls who are semi-interested, but flake out or change their mind later or always make excuses not to meet up. Overall, it's a zero sum game and a waste of time.

8. Church groups. Most women in churches are married and have families. If there are single women, they are usually not attractive. I've never heard of anyone finding a great woman to date at a church singles social. Besides, if you join a church just to meet women and aren't really interested in its religion, then you are in effect deceiving everyone at the congregation, which is not good for your conscience. Having to pretend to be interested in the faith everyday when you're not is bad for the soul. And even if you meet a single woman you like at a church, there's no guarantee that she will like you. She could still be very picky or have personality problems or not be looking. Women have too many choices in America, so if they're still single, there's usually a reason. Some women can't get along with other people, or simply don't like being attached.

All the above venues are ways you are "supposed" to be able to meet women in America, yet they don't really work, at least not most of the time. So basically, everything is against you in America when it comes to dating and social life. And no, having a "positive attitude" does not change the above, despite what people say. Cliches like that are useless and do not change reality or improve anything. It seems that if you don't find your sweetheart in high school or college, you are out of luck. But even in high school and college, the social cliques there still feel exclusive and closed. So even school is not exactly an inclusive environment.

American social life basically involves trying to break into closed cliques that don't want you. It's akin to trying to break down a wall that was designed to keep you out -- which is definitely not natural or friendly at all. Needless to say, trying to break into a social group that doesn't want you is the most awkward and unnatural thing.

How can something as simple and basic as human relationships be so difficult in America? That is so odd. Why does trying to get a romantic partner in America feel like you are going against the flow of things? That is so weird and negative. There must be something wrong with that.

So now do you understand why I'm asking this question now? There does not seem to be any easy, natural or smooth way to meet women to get a girlfriend or wife in America. You seem to be BLOCKED from every angle. Yet in spite of all this, whenever you go out in America, you see couples everywhere, so you gotta wonder how they get together. Am I missing something? What's missing from the equation?

So how then do most normal mainstream men find a wife or girlfriend in America? How does society expect you to find a partner in America? How do married men and guys with girlfriends in America find their partner in spite of all the above? Can anyone explain or provide logical answers to this valid question?

How would a mainstream person or psychologist or a defender of American culture answer this question, I wonder? Most mainstream people I know either avoid such taboo questions, or spout the usual useless cliches (e.g. just go out there and do stuff and you'll meet girls, etc). Have you guys had any luck getting mainstream people to answer such questions?

Now I know society has cliches such as "just go out and meet people" but as we all know, such cliches aren't realistic and don't work, since all the above obstacles don't make it easy or natural at all. There seems to be a cultural myth and assumption in America that people are friendly, so if you want to make friends, all you have to do is to go out there and be friendly and social, and that's it. But it obviously isn't that simple. So am I missing something? Do we have aspergers or something? Is that why we ask such questions and "normal" people don't?

[Yohan]

I have a curious question: How do NORMAL men find girlfriends and wives in America? I know that sounds like a stupid question...

This is not a stupid question.
Same problem in Western Europe.

Most women have anyway several boyfriends already, how to line up as the next one on her list?

Some US-citizens I know here in Japan - all with foreign wives from Asia, told me the only what you could try in USA is visiting churches if you are religious and into Christianity, if you are into alcohol and drugs try your luck in discos and bars - and otherwise your options are rather limited = internet.

Out of my bad experiences, I advice strongly against any conversation/dating in schools and at the workplace.
If something is going wrong you will find yourself as the center of scorn or false accusations.

All in all, you have a very limited choice to meet new people in USA and other Western countries if you don't have a large number of relatives, who might be helpful with introduction during meeting or parties.

[Banano]

It could be that whole country has Aspergers ? Its not as far fetched as you might think

I see examples of it every day, my neighbors are deliberately avoiding eye contact with me and when we bump into ea in car park they are so awkward,antisocial and shy which isnt normal, they are the the same people who have 1000+ fb friends, go figure.

Everyone seems paranoid even though country is one of the safest in the world, neighbors dont trust neighbors for no reason

Country is infected by some evil antisocial disease

[GoingAwol]

If you fail to find a girlfriend in school you are pretty much left with women you could meet through social circles and online dating. Meeting women through social circles is not a great way to meet women despite what most people say. Why do I say this? Because it is no guarantee that you will like the women you meet or they will like you. So meeting women through social circles is no guarantee for success either.
Online dating? We don't even have to go there... We all know it sucks...its like throwing your heart and your dick at the wall over and over again and hoping something sticks.

[Mr.Darcy]

If you fail to find a girlfriend in school you are pretty much left with women you could meet through social circles and online dating. Meeting women through social circles is not a great way to meet women despite what most people say. Why do I say this? Because it is no guarantee that you will like the women you meet or they will like you. So meeting women through social circles is no guarantee for success either.
Online dating? We don't even have to go there... We all know it sucks...its like throwing your heart and your dick at the wall over and over again and hoping something sticks.

This, they probably knew them in high school or something.

[chanta76]

Marriage rate is down actually in America. They say in the future there will be more singles than married people. Online dating is still going up and there are lots of guys looking towards PUA. At the same time there is growing number of guys who look overseas for girl friends.

I really think in every society and culture there is maybe 10% of guys who can get many many girls. I think America is like that. I seen guys who have multiple girl friends..and yes I have to agree with Yohan there are American women who have multiple boy friends but it's not the majority of american women who is like this. If anything it's the 10 % of guys who get like 80% of the girls.

I would say for those guys who still somehow are able to get a girl do it either by their social network but it's hard.

[chanta76]

I also this will cause the demise of America..family is the basic of society but if you don't have men able to meet decent girls and get married it's the end of society as we know it. It won't happen over night but it will take some time but look towards any society that has a break down.

[Ghost]

.

[celery2010]

The "flyover" states are easier to find gf's, wives. And in more traditional states women get married early.

So high school, college, and maybe for more ambitious types, grad school. Holding out until you start working is only for people who live in major cities.

Typically high school or college, a part time job you have where dating is ok (working in a restaurant). Most people stay in the same place, so they will know a lot of the local people.

[Maverick]

It's doable, but requires a lot of time and effort.

From what I've seen, it's feast or famine. Either you have a ton of girls or you have none. If you have a ton of girls, then you are probably working out constantly, hitting on a lot of girls, and doing a lot of things that society deems interesting (and, of course, post these "interesting" things on Facebook).

I do think that just about any man can elevated himself into the Top 20%, but it will require a lot more work from some than others.

But I also agree that women generally find exactly the same things attractive (and men must live up to that ideal to be successful).

[Winston]

It could be that whole country has Aspergers ? Its not as far fetched as you might think

I see examples of it every day, my neighbors are deliberately avoiding eye contact with me and when we bump into ea in car park they are so awkward,antisocial and shy which isnt normal, they are the the same people who have 1000+ fb friends, go figure.

Everyone seems paranoid even though country is one of the safest in the world, neighbors dont trust neighbors for no reason

Country is infected by some evil antisocial disease

That would be funny and ironic if it turned out that the mainstream majority are the ones with aspergers and not us. lol. It would go in line with great quotes like these:

"The sick individual finds himself at home with all other similarly sick individuals. The whole culture is geared to this kind of pathology. The result is that the average individual does not experience the separateness and isolation the fully schizophrenic person feels. He feels at ease among those who suffer from the same deformation; in fact, it is the fully sane person who feels isolated in the insane society - and he may suffer so much from the incapacity to communicate that it is he who may become psychotic." - Eric Fromm, Swiss Psychologist (The Anatomy of Human Destructiveness)

"A time will come when the whole world will go mad. And to anyone who is not mad they will say: 'You are mad, for you are not like us.'" - St. Anthony the Great (attributed to)

"When the world goes mad, one must accept madness as sanity; since sanity is, in the last analysis, nothing but the madness on which the whole world happens to agree." - George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950), British playwright

"In a mad world, only the mad are sane." - Akiro Kurosawa

[Winston]

If you fail to find a girlfriend in school you are pretty much left with women you could meet through social circles and online dating. Meeting women through social circles is not a great way to meet women despite what most people say. Why do I say this? Because it is no guarantee that you will like the women you meet or they will like you. So meeting women through social circles is no guarantee for success either.
Online dating? We don't even have to go there... We all know it sucks...its like throwing your heart and your dick at the wall over and over again and hoping something sticks.

Yes you are right. I just added four more items to the opening post, four other ways you are "supposed" to meet women in America but don't work in reality. They include social groups and online dating too. See the updated opening post.

Yeah even if you do break into a social clique, still, if you aren't their type, the girls are still going to friendzone you. In any group, the girls go for the "alpha male" or the guys who are the most dominant and charismatic and lead the group. Same with groups of primates. And that's assuming that there are girls in your social group of course. Some groups, such as cliques full of geeks, misfits, D&D players, RPG players, video gamers, chess groups, sci fi groups, etc. have no girls in them.

However, even if there are girls in your social clique, there are usually MORE guys than girls in most social cliques, so there aren't enough girls to go around. It's not like in that stupid sitcom "Friends" where there are an equal number of guys and girls in the clique. This means that the numbers don't work in your favor either. In America, everything is against you.

[Winston]

If you fail to find a girlfriend in school you are pretty much left with women you could meet through social circles and online dating. Meeting women through social circles is not a great way to meet women despite what most people say. Why do I say this? Because it is no guarantee that you will like the women you meet or they will like you. So meeting women through social circles is no guarantee for success either.
Online dating? We don't even have to go there... We all know it sucks...its like throwing your heart and your dick at the wall over and over again and hoping something sticks.

This, they probably knew them in high school or something.

I am skeptical of that. Usually high school sweethearts break up when they go to college right? They usually show this with high school couples on TV too. They are usually shown on TV talking about having to break up when they go away to college in separate directions, where they eventually meet other people. So I doubt if the majority of men marry their high school sweethearts. I'd like to see studies on this.

However, even in college, I did not notice that the girls were interested in meeting people. They seemed pretty focused on their school work and after school, they did not hang around to try to meet people, but quickly left to go home to their boyfriend or husband. So where is all the hype about college having a great wild social life? I never saw it. Did I go to the wrong college, or are all colleges and universities pretty much like that in the US?

The friendliest girls in college were the foreign ones that were not Americanized. However, they are mostly Asian and I wasn't into Asian girls when I was in college. If I had, I might have done a lot better.

[Winston]

Most guys find wives in America. The trick is the timing.

When your in your 20s, you're supposed to be incel.

When she is in her 20s, she's supposed to ride the carousel with a variety of Chad Thundercocks.

When you're in your 30s, you start becoming more successful professionally and financially.

When she's in her 30s, she recognizes what a good wallet...er, man, you are.

Get married, and happily ever after until she divorces you and destroys your life.

And that's how normal guys get wives in America.

What do you mean? Guys in their 20's are horny and do try to get dates. If you go to the mall, you will see many guys with girlfriends who are both in their teens and twenties. You haven't explained how guys in their 30's get women in America. How do they do it, in spite of all the above?

Go to any suburb with houses and you will see married couples in all those houses. So my question is, how did those couples hook up? How do they even meet?

In America, there is this assumption that every guy who wants a wife or girlfriend already has one, so it's not an issue that is worth even discussing. The only issues that matter are getting a job and financial/economic issues. These are all that's talked about in public media, because those are the only problems that exist. Loneliness, datelessness, and sexlessness are not problems that even exist. That's the assumption that everyone assumes, including the news media. So why do we consider these to be a problem when everyone else thinks only financial problems are the only issues that exist? Very weird.

[GoingAwol]

Winston,
He made a funny but it was true. He said most guys are incel in their 20s because women are only sleeping with the top tier guys. However, these women become interested in the other men in their 30s when their biological clock is ticking and they want to have babies.