Momopi, HOT Taiwanese girl I met! What should I do?

[publicduende]

If you only met her online, how do you know she wasn't just a cock teaser? Some women like to play with your mind, and then when you show up, they make some excuse not to see you or flake out. It's really weird. Some women are all talk and no action.

Also, remember she has nothing to lose by being wild and horny online, and it doesn't mean she will be wild and horny in person. Murphy's Law also rules much of life.

I've never seen a profile like that from Taiwan before.

Well, that's precisely why I chose not to go and visit her. I was happy to have her as an occasional cam sex friend, for as much as she would insist about me flying over and spend a week with her. Funny thing is, at some point she bought herself a massive dildo and started to use it during our "sessions" as a further proof that she was waiting for me. From what I could tell from our voice chats (it wasn't all video!), she did seem to have a high libido in person as well, albeit a frustrated one for not having a Western man handy.

LOL When was this? Why didn't she just go out and get a Western guy living in Taiwan? There are plenty of them. It doesn't make any sense. The universe sometimes likes to play tricks on us.

I'm not sure now, Winston, and was none the wiser back then. It was 2006. Perhaps Claire was doing the same thing with a bunch of other men, or perhaps she was hooked on me because she felt she would expose herself more with a guy she were to meet in person. Or perhaps she genuinely looked forward to having me in the sack. At that time I was objectively younger, thinner and fitter, and still with the same decent size down there

[publicduende]

Well, some girls are also into 'phone sex'. A few years ago, I met one from Asia Friend Finder like that living in Kaoshuing. If u r good at 'phone' and get her off a couple or more times, she may become curious and keen to meet u. If u meet her face-to-face, the chemistry factor will still be important but your chances will be much higher than an average first date given your shared experiences.

It's true. Girls are much easier than I thought to engage in phone sex and, easier still, cam sex because it titillates a few of their usual buttons: sexual desire, exhibitionism, and a mix of high level of intrigue and low level of risk (especially with somebody from far away, who has absolutely no chance to know her family or social circle). It's easier when they have their natural "hots", so 10 days to 2 days before their period. The problem is, even if having great cam sex for a few weeks were to guarantee one or two weeks of real sex upon meeting in person, would one still want to invest time and money and visit the girl in her home country?

I would also agree about the chemistry factor. Having cam sex is a much faster and bolder move towards mutual intimacy than days, or weeks, of conversation, especially if good conversations are had anyway. A woman is hardly going back on her steps once she has chosen to show you her skin. In her mind, you already are a sex partner waiting to be met and, if decent looking enough, you can be sure she'll be having a few fantasies on you. I had a long time Filipino chat friend who I used to talk to and text on and off for a few years, as a simple friend. I then managed to meet her in person when I travelled to Zhuhai in 2009, after a few conversations and cams with her (which didn't involve much sex). When she came up to my hotel room to meet me for the first time, she literally jumped on me as if I was her current boyfriend, or somebody she had known intimately for ages.

[momopi]

So my question Momopi is, how do you play the dating game in Taiwan, given the above? Can you explain this, without another irrelevant wisecrack or spin that deviates from the question at hand? This is a serious question that I really want answers to.?

1. As I have already said many, many times, I do not live in Taiwan. I meet ( or be introduced to) girls in TW, get their contact info, and chat with them causally online & via Skype for several months. The ones who are not interested will simply drop off, and the ones who are interested will be there when I arrive on next visit, or she will come visit me in California. If things go really well we might meet somewhere for vacation. Simple enough?

In the IT field you spend a lot of time after hours at work. Much of the time is spent waiting for other people, I.e. waiting for DBA to finish a backup before you can deploy new code. I sit in my cube, eat dinner paid by work, scratch my arse, chat with girls in Taiwan or SG online about what I ordered for dinner, and get paid OT. I have already told you this when I was in Chayi and we took a walk across that bridge by the lake. If you're thinking "I can't do what you do" or "some guys don't have the patience", you should be thinking about what you can do and not what you won't do.


2. I have no experience living in Taiwan full time as an adult. Zero, zip, nada. if you were to ask "what would you do if you lived here full time", all I can provide is a guesstimate with no proven rate of success. It's no different from you asking "why does she prefer XYZ" when I can only guess her motives when you could have simply asked the girl directly and get your answer from the horses mouth.

You live in Taiwan full time. You have much greater opportunity to interact with local girls and observe what they do. If you have questions about local dating etiquette, all you have to do is ask the local girls. Is there some reason that you have to ask people who don't live in Taiwan full time, when you can simply ask the locals? If you have the mentality or attitude that you are in Taiwan to impart and not receive, then all you will find might be brick walls and thorny bushes.

Again, I do not understand why we are having this conversation if your goal is to be in China and date girls in China.


3. You are the one who stated that your goal is to go to China. If you do not want me to try and keep you on track and on target, simply say so and I will not bother.

So, have you obtained travel documents for China?

[Winston]

So my question Momopi is, how do you play the dating game in Taiwan, given the above? Can you explain this, without another irrelevant wisecrack or spin that deviates from the question at hand? This is a serious question that I really want answers to.?

1. As I have already said many, many times, I do not live in Taiwan. I meet ( or be introduced to) girls in TW, get their contact info, and chat with them causally online & via Skype for several months. The ones who are not interested will simply drop off, and the ones who are interested will be there when I arrive on next visit, or she will come visit me in California. If things go really well we might meet somewhere for vacation. Simple enough?

In the IT field you spend a lot of time after hours at work. Much of the time is spent waiting for other people, I.e. waiting for DBA to finish a backup before you can deploy new code. I sit in my cube, eat dinner paid by work, scratch my arse, chat with girls in Taiwan or SG online about what I ordered for dinner, and get paid OT. I have already told you this when I was in Chayi and we took a walk across that bridge by the lake.


2. I have no experience living in Taiwan full time as an adult. Zero, zip, nada. if you were to ask "what would you o if you lived here full time", all I can provide is a guesstimate with no proven rate of success. It's no different from you asking "why does she prefer XYZ" when I can only guess her motives when you could have simply asked the girl directly and get your answer from the horses mouth.

You live in Taiwan full time. You have much greater opportunity to interact with local girls and observe what they do. If you have questions about local dating etiquette, all you have to do is ask the local girls. Is there some reason that you have to ask people who don't live in Taiwan full time, when you can simply ask the locals? If you have the mentality or attitude that you are in Taiwan to impart and not receive, then all you will find might be brick walls and thorny bushes.

Again, I do not understand why we are having this conversation if your goal is to be in China and date girls in China.


3. You are the one who stated that your goal is to go to China. If you do not want me to try and keep you on track and on target, simply say so and I will not bother.

So, have you obtained travel documents for China?

Well you portray yourself as an expert in Asian culture here, based on your many posts. So why not ask you? You know more about Taiwan than anyone else here, with the exception of Rock.

I am physically in Taiwan but I don't go out much. I told you before. I only have a few weeks experience in going out. Going out here is a torturous experience. You see so many hot girls every second and every minute but can't have any of them, so you wonder "How can there be hot girls everywhere all around every minute, yet I can't get a single one? It's so depressing."

Why are you so one track minded? Why can't I have multiple goals? Sure China is a goal, but so is Taiwan. I just want to understand what went wrong since a lot of what I experience in Taiwan doesn't make sense and is not logical.

Yes I've obtained my travel documents for China. I have the compatriot permit. Can you slow down time? What if the world ends this year in 2012 before I go to China, as Rock told me the other day? lol

[momopi]

Well you portray yourself as an expert in Asian culture here, based on your many posts. So why not ask you? You know more about Taiwan than anyone else here, with the exception of Rock.
I am physically in Taiwan but I don't go out much. I told you before. I only have a few weeks experience in going out. Going out here is a torturous experience. You see so many hot girls every second and every minute but can't have any of them, so you wonder "How can there be hot girls everywhere all around every minute, yet I can't get a single one? It's so depressing."
Why are you so one track minded? Why can't I have multiple goals? Sure China is a goal, but so is Taiwan. I just want to understand what went wrong since a lot of what I experience in Taiwan doesn't make sense and is not logical.
Yes I've obtained my travel documents for China. I have the compatriot permit. Can you slow down time? What if the world ends this year in 2012 before I go to China, as Rock told me the other day? lol

A project has a predefined start and close. The five steps are initiate - plan - execute - monitor/control - close. Say if your goal is to bake cookies and give them to a girl:

Initiate: figure out what cookie you want to bake and who you want to give them to.
Plan: get recipe and shopping list (flour, chocolate chips, etc.)
Execute: buy the ingredients, make cookie dough, bake cookies.
Monitor/control: watch the clock and make sure cookies are not burned in the oven.
Close: gift wrap cookies and give to girl.

Now say you also want to bake a cake, but you only have one oven. So if you want to bake both, which requires different temperatures, you must bake one before the other. In doing so you complicate things and create dependencies across 2 projects.

Getting travel docs to go to China is a real perquisite. Trying to score in Taiwan before you go to China is a self imposed dependency (or resource restraint). There is only one of you, and time spend on Taiwan is not time spent on China.

One could argue that time spent in Taiwan to improve conversational Chinese will help with going to China, just as learning how to mix cake batter will improve kitchen skills. But cake making is still not the same as baking cookies. If you want to make oatmeal cookies, the best way is still to practice by baking oatmeal cookies.

[CerealKiller]

Winston,

So are you wrapping things up in TW and moving to China? Or just going on a little vacation to see how things go?

I know you always seem to be bashing cold approach, but it's worked like a charm for me over the years. Basically every country I've been to, and I've visited my fair share. And just in case you're wondering, it's not as if I dress all GQ.

I feel that if you work on your game a little, you might see some results. At the very least, Rock should be able to pull off cold approaches in TW. As a tall white guy in Asia, he can play that card. And as for you... You have home court advantage! That's your angle right there Winston.

[Winston]

I sent the questions to Momopi to the Taiwanese girl I paid to translate my article. Here was her response:

Hi, Winston.

I think because in Taiwan or chinese culture,
girls are all friendly and kind at first.
because our culture taught us that we need to be friendly to anyone,
especially when you're first time to meet someone.
but if the girl feel you want to chase her, and she doesn't want to have a relationship with,
she will not go out with you (but if talking on the phone is ok~).
maybe is the point~
hope my response can help you~

So if a girl doesn't want to date you in Taiwan, she won't go out with you, not even in a group? Sounds similar to the US. So why do people say that it's easy to get a girl in Taiwan? I've asked this hundreds of times already but no one has given me an answer.

Momopi, how is it that you, as a walking encyclopedia and highly educated intellectual, can't answer my questions, but an average 20 year old Taiwanese girl can? LOL

[momopi]

So if a girl doesn't want to date you in Taiwan, she won't go out with you, not even in a group? Sounds similar to the US. So why do people say that it's easy to get a girl in Taiwan? I've asked this hundreds of times already but no one has given me an answer.
Momopi, how is it that you, as a walking encyclopedia and highly educated intellectual, can't answer my questions, but an average 20 year old Taiwanese girl can? LOL

If you want o know how to build an igloo, do you ask a professor of Eskimo studies at UCLA who reads encyclopedias, or an Eskimo with no formal education but has 20 year experience building igloos?

Intellectuals are overrated like nice guys are in surplus. Read too much, think too much, but do little.

So, do you have an ETA for China trip?

[Rock]

Momopi,
I have a serious and puzzling question for you.

During the past 6 or 7 days, Rock and I met a lot of girls in Taiwan out in public, both in clean and seedy places. Some of them were introduced to Rock by a Chinese woman I'm seeing too.

But the thing is, even if our interaction with them was friendly, cordial, and we got good vibes from them, still, Rock refused to call or text them the next few days and ask them to meet us again. He said he either got mixed vibes, or that it wasn't appropriate to be that forward in Taiwan.

I've even experienced instances where a Taiwanese girl I met was friendly to me on cell phone messaging, but as soon as I asked her out, she became cold and distant, as if asking them out is a sin or something. It's like I break some rule by asking them out. Sheesh. (WTF? So weird.)

This reminds me, it does seem that Taiwanese girls don't like it when I ask them out directly, even if the initial meeting was friendly and positive. So maybe Rock is right. But why is that? Can you explain this to me? Obviously, if this "social rule" even applies to Rock, who is fairly tall and handsome and white, then it's an objective social rule that doesn't just apply to me.

What I'm saying is that if I have a positive friendly meeting or interaction with a girl, I can't just contact her the next day and say, "It was nice meeting you. You are pretty cool. What are you up to? Are you free tomorrow? Maybe we can meet for coffee or something." like I can in the rest of the "normal world".

So how can you meet them again or date anyone, for that matter, if you aren't allowed to ask them out directly? I don't get it. Are you supposed to chat with them forever and wait til they offer to meet you again? What if they never do? How is it supposed to work in Taiwan?

You know, I've heard of moving slow, but if you can't even ask them to meet again... um gee, that's crazy... and seems unwinnable. What gives?!

Furthermore, why do many people say that it's easy to get a girlfriend in Taiwan, when you aren't even allowed to ask girls out directly, but instead have to play complicated mind/social games that are above the head of most guys? It doesn't make any sense! I keep asking this question over and over again, but no one has given me an answer.

Case in point: My Chinese lady friend introduced Rock to two young attractive tall Taiwanese girls, both of whom gave Rock positive vibes and signaled an interest in getting to know him. However, in spite of that, Rock refused to message them to ask for another meeting. One girl he thought was too innocent, and the other gave him mixed signals (though I thought I saw positive signals from her).

So again, if this applies to Rock too, then obviously it's not something that's wrong with me. I witnessed this problem over and over again firsthand last week. So I know it's not my imagination, regardless of what anyone says.

Obviously, asking girls out in Taiwan or dating them is a lot more complicated than I thought. It's like you have to play some kind of mind game, like in the US, except you have to be much more subtle and innocent at it here. You can't just say "Let's go out" and then arrange a meeting.

What this means is that overall, one can meet many friendly Taiwanese girls if you have the patience to chat them up and talk about inane lighthearted things for a while. However, escalating it into a second meeting from there, or trying to take things to the next level, is a whole different ballgame, one that is very complicated and unclear. Not easy at all.

So my question Momopi is, how do you play the dating game in Taiwan, given the above? Can you explain this, without another irrelevant wisecrack or spin that deviates from the question at hand? This is a serious question that I really want answers to.

Thanks.

Rock, have I misunderstood or misstated anything?

1. Reason for holding-off on restaurant girl even tho we chatted once on phone: She has to work most every night from 4pm-2am in her parents' canteen so only way to interact w/her is to go there and chat under her parents watch + she seems like fairly innocent and naive type + she's really slim for my taste + she seems not that bright and kinda seemed to have a boring personality + Ling Ling asked me not to pursue her if I wasn't serious

2. Reason for holding-off on Far Eastone girl: she's just 20 or 21 and best not to be too eager or aggressive w/that age group unless u too are still a 20 something + I sensed that she was behaving more out of politeness to her friend (Ling Ling) than out of genuine interest to meet someone new (also I tested her by observing her eyes and with a subtle hand touch (ostensibly to crack her small knuckle) when I went over to sit close w/her and have that discussion about facials and skin care and did not get a positive green light, more like an ambiguous response at best).

[Rock]

One could argue that time spent in Taiwan to improve conversational Chinese will help with going to China, just as learning how to mix cake batter will improve kitchen skills. But cake making is still not the same as baking cookies. If you want to make oatmeal cookies, the best way is still to practice by baking oatmeal cookies.

Well his Mandarin does seem to have improved a lot. Or perhaps I just never heard him speak it before. Ling Ling speaks some Taiwanese but of course she's much more comfortable in Mandarin since she is from non-Taiwanese speaking part of China so she often reverts to Mandarin when speaking to Winston.

[momopi]

One could argue that time spent in Taiwan to improve conversational Chinese will help with going to China, just as learning how to mix cake batter will improve kitchen skills. But cake making is still not the same as baking cookies. If you want to make oatmeal cookies, the best way is still to practice by baking oatmeal cookies.

Well his Mandarin does seem to have improved a lot. Or perhaps I just never heard him speak it before. Ling Ling speaks some Taiwanese but of course she's much more comfortable in Mandarin since she is from non-Taiwanese speaking part of China so she often reverts to Mandarin when speaking to Winston.

Since she is from Mainland, her value would be to teach Winston the differences between Mandarin-Guoyu usage in TW vs Mandarin-Putonghua in China.

[momopi]

I am physically in Taiwan but I don't go out much. I told you before. I only have a few weeks experience in going out.

In sum, how many girls did you meet in those few weeks of going out?

[celery2010]

Had to post this here as well:

Well this fat, unattractive guy was able to find a nice cute girl

http://www.chinasmack.com/2009/pictures ... riend.html

[celery2010]

Well it looks like that vegetarian girl I like already has a boyfriend. Darn. All the good ones are taken, as they say.

Here is a photo of them below. How did a nerdy looking plain guy like him get a cutie like that? How come ugly guys can date girls that are my type in Taiwan but I can't? Doesn't that suck? Why is everything in my life always Murphy's Law? Why is it that only girls who are not my type like me and the ones who are my type never like me seriously?

First of all, that girl is really nothing special. She is wearing a cute outfit that makes her look better than she really looks. Take a picture of her at home in a t-shirt and long pants, she is just a typical girl.

Goto China and throw a stone in a crowd and you will find a girl just like her. There are millions of chicks like this in China just waiting for a foreigner from America.

Secondly, this guy is still a better prospect than you. He is well dressed, looks like he is in good physical shape, healthy and looks fairly intelligent. He even LOOKS like the kind of person who has a good job and is responsible. So he beats you on looks, money and responsibility. Your only possible leverage is that an American citizenship is of slightly higher value than a Taiwanese one.

Again, get yourself to China or try another part of Southeast Asia if that is more of your liking, if you are not having luck in Taiwan.
I'm still of the opinion that there are opportunities in Taiwan.

If you goto China and make an effort to meet girls, although it may take a little while, you will meet girls. As long as you are a good person and good to them (and have American citizenship), there will be girls willing to overlook the other stuff. I saw attractive girls with unattractive guys who either had money or great personalities every single day in China. It is not uncommon.

I also think that it is not uncommon in Korea or Japan either.

If you are serious about looking for a nice girl for marriage, i would highly recommend you visit a church in Taiwan as well. I attended a church in Taipei and they had services in English and there were many cute girls. Just don't mention that you like to visit massage parlors and try to be a good person.

[Winston]

Well it looks like that vegetarian girl I like already has a boyfriend. Darn. All the good ones are taken, as they say.

Here is a photo of them below. How did a nerdy looking plain guy like him get a cutie like that? How come ugly guys can date girls that are my type in Taiwan but I can't? Doesn't that suck? Why is everything in my life always Murphy's Law? Why is it that only girls who are not my type like me and the ones who are my type never like me seriously?

First of all, that girl is really nothing special. She is wearing a cute outfit that makes her look better than she really looks. Take a picture of her at home in a t-shirt and long pants, she is just a typical girl.

Goto China and throw a stone in a crowd and you will find a girl just like her. There are millions of chicks like this in China just waiting for a foreigner from America.

Secondly, this guy is still a better prospect than you. He is well dressed, looks like he is in good physical shape, healthy and looks fairly intelligent. He even LOOKS like the kind of person who has a good job and is responsible. So he beats you on looks, money and responsibility. Your only possible leverage is that an American citizenship is of slightly higher value than a Taiwanese one.

Again, get yourself to China or try another part of Southeast Asia if that is more of your liking, if you are not having luck in Taiwan.
I'm still of the opinion that there are opportunities in Taiwan.

If you goto China and make an effort to meet girls, although it may take a little while, you will meet girls. As long as you are a good person and good to them (and have American citizenship), there will be girls willing to overlook the other stuff. I saw attractive girls with unattractive guys who either had money or great personalities every single day in China. It is not uncommon.

I also think that it is not uncommon in Korea or Japan either.

If you are serious about looking for a nice girl for marriage, i would highly recommend you visit a church in Taiwan as well. I attended a church in Taipei and they had services in English and there were many cute girls. Just don't mention that you like to visit massage parlors and try to be a good person.

WTF are you smoking?! That guy is just a college student. How much do you want to bet that I have a lot more money than he does in my bank account? He can't even afford to travel, like I can.

God are you stupid or what?

He is just skinny. That doesn't mean he is in shape. I could easily kick his ass. Wanna bet money on it?

His dress is nothing special. Anyone can dress in business attire. I dress like that too, but not everyday, only in business occasions. Duh. Are you stupid?

He does not beat me on money. Why do you think he has more money? He's just a student. God are you stupid? I can easily outspend a college stupid.

He is just thinner and younger. That's all. That's his only advantage over me.

I am a million times more interesting than an average weak timid dull Taiwanese guy. Every western girl I've talked to here agrees, and says that Taiwanese guys are the lamest dullest most boring guys they've ever met, and that they'd never consider dating a typical one.

Celery, are you f***ing stupid? What are you smoking? Why are you BSing and saying things that aren't true?