When did America stop being a great country?

[Temprano26]

If there is one theme that unites all of us it is that at some point we came to the conclusion that the US sucks to live in now. Probably that stems from spending a lot of time alone and looking around at the bored, pissed off, irritated, stressed out looks on people's faces.

Whatever it is that is grieving us about the US, it was not one thing. We probably came to that conclusion after a long chain of things. When did that start and when did going to another country seem less extreme and more of a rational concrete solution?

What if Winston Wu came to you ten years ago and suggested you would be happier abroad? Would you have thought that too extreme?

[Bitch_Slapper]

Well, ten years ago, php discussion boards were already on the internet, talking about expatriating. By then, it was obvious that the country (and the women) had gone downhill.

What's diffferent now is that the problems have become even more glaring, and easier to notice. We could go back decades and point to numerous sources, but I'd say September 11, 2001 really got the ball rolling, accelerating the misery and corruption the country is experiencing today.

[QuestionMark]

Well america was never a great country. It always sucked. It peaked in the 80's and 90's though, but even then it was better to live abroad.

I realized how shit the u.s. was when I was 16 and I've wanted to leave every since.

[somedude]

I think it's always sucked, it's just more out in the open with the internet.

Humans have short memories too, and not much of those memories get passed on to the next generation if at all. Thus repeatedly people go through a cycle of growing up thinking things are peachy and then learning the reality and either try to deal with it and maybe even promote change or burying it in their psyche and pretending nothing is wrong.

I also think that not just America, but civilization as a whole has sucked on this planet for a very very long time. We may have different gadgets, tools and tech throughout history. However the problems, corruption and manipulation are always exactly the same it seems.

[jtest28]

I think it's always sucked, it's just more out in the open with the Internet.

Humans have short memories too, and not much of those memories get passed on to the next generation if at all. Thus repeatedly people go through a cycle of growing up thinking things are peachy and then learning the reality and either try to deal with it and maybe even promote change or burying it in their psyche and pretending nothing is wrong.
I also think that not just America, but civilization as a whole has sucked on this planet for a very very long time. We may have different gadgets, tools and tech throughout history. However the problems, corruption and manipulation are always exactly the same it seems.

Yeah, I agree. So I will just say in my lifetime, looking back, it looks like the USA peaked out in the mid 80s and started a bit of a downhill plunge in the late 80s, and by the start of the 90s was full blown downhill.

[Temprano26]

The 90s were the Bill Clinton years. Remember he said "there is nothing wrong with America that cannot be fixed by what is right with America".

Do you think that still holds true? Cause I have lost faith in it.

[MrPeabody]

The change was dramatic starting in 1963 with the assassination of JFK and accelerated when the Beatles arrived in America in 1964. The Vietnam war gave the cultural Marxists the opportunity they needed to infiltrate the system and Johnson dramatically expanded the welfare state. Now the leftist democrats have the majority of American dependent on government, their power is secure, at least until the crash. The politicians today are pygmies compared to the leaders even 50 years ago and it is getting worse. They are so completely hideous that I can't stand listening to any of them for even a minute. The media has degenerated to nothing more than a propaganda arm of the government. News use to be serious with anchors like Walter Cronkite who always acted in a way to inspire trust. Now, cable news programs don't even pretend to be presenting objective news and talking heads scream at each other to keep the dimwits interested. The culture is complete garbage. Miley Cyrus with her tongue sticking out is the new Statue of Liberty.

[johnnyderp]

It's funny, I was watching Back to The Future 2 the other day. It's only one year away from 2015, and it seems America isn't far removed from the hellish 2015 of Biff's world when he uses the Sports Almanac to become rich and powerful and help create a toxic, immoral culture. It was so uncanny.

So the solution to America's woes is to travel back to 1955 and make sure the young Biff doesn't get the Almanac.

[Halwick]

What do you all mean by "great country"?

Do you define a "great country" where one has personal freedom to take risks and say or do whatever you want?

Do you define a "great country" where there are opportunities to make money and raise your standard of living?

Or do you define "great country" as having the willingness and confidence to face a challenge head on, conquer it and master it?

In my lifetime, the US reached it's zenith around the mid 1960s. Up until then, the US was not afraid of building the biggest and the best and not afraid to conquer new frontiers; people had a confident view of the future and the future held unlimited potential. The country also had a stable and moral society.

During in the late 1960s and 1970s I saw the breakdown in morals, law and order and social stability. That, in my opinion, is when the U.S. stopped being a great country as earlier defined. The downhill came much earlier than you all believe.

@QuestionMark, If America was never a great country as you believe, why are people from ABROAD still coming to this country? Why do THEY think America offers more freedom and opportunity to live a better life than their country? You ought to live in Israel or Russia and see how much peace and freedom you can have. Or live in India with its caste system restrictions. Or live in Southeast Asia with its lower quality of infrastructure. You don't know how good you have it here and how good you have it to express your opinions.

[nicho12]

What do you all mean by "great country"?

Do you define a "great country" where one has personal freedom to take risks and say or do whatever you want?

Do you define a "great country" where there are opportunities to make money and raise your standard of living?

Or do you define "great country" as having the willingness and confidence to face a challenge head on, conquer it and master it?

In my lifetime, the US reached it's zenith around the mid 1960s. Up until then, the US was not afraid of building the biggest and the best and not afraid to conquer new frontiers; people had a confident view of the future and the future held unlimited potential. The country also had a stable and moral society.

During in the late 1960s and 1970s I saw the breakdown in morals, law and order and social stability. That, in my opinion, is when the U.S. stopped being a great country as earlier defined. The downhill came much earlier than you all believe.

@QuestionMark, If America was never a great country as you believe, why are people from ABROAD still coming to this country? Why do THEY think America offers more freedom and opportunity to live a better life than their country? You ought to live in Israel or Russia and see how much peace and freedom you can have. Or live in India with its caste system restrictions. Or live in Southeast Asia with its lower quality of infrastructure. You don't know how good you have it here and how good you have it to express your opinions.

It's obvious you've been drinking too much Koo-laid from television, the reason why Immigrants still come here is because Hollywood films lie to them that America is a great country and by the time they get here, some of them have sold their houses back home and can't face the shame of going back, you don't know how many immigrants I've met personally especially the male immigrants who tell me how they regret ever moving to America, but can't go back because now they have nothing to go back to since they sold their belongings.

[Temprano26]

I met an expatriate in Bocas Del Toro who said "yeah, immigrants used to come to America all the time and now America is so ****ed up they are all going back".

[QuestionMark]

What do you all mean by "great country"?

Do you define a "great country" where one has personal freedom to take risks and say or do whatever you want?

Do you define a "great country" where there are opportunities to make money and raise your standard of living?

Or do you define "great country" as having the willingness and confidence to face a challenge head on, conquer it and master it?

In my lifetime, the US reached it's zenith around the mid 1960s. Up until then, the US was not afraid of building the biggest and the best and not afraid to conquer new frontiers; people had a confident view of the future and the future held unlimited potential. The country also had a stable and moral society.

During in the late 1960s and 1970s I saw the breakdown in morals, law and order and social stability. That, in my opinion, is when the U.S. stopped being a great country as earlier defined. The downhill came much earlier than you all believe.

@QuestionMark, If America was never a great country as you believe, why are people from ABROAD still coming to this country? Why do THEY think America offers more freedom and opportunity to live a better life than their country? You ought to live in Israel or Russia and see how much peace and freedom you can have. Or live in India with its caste system restrictions. Or live in Southeast Asia with its lower quality of infrastructure. You don't know how good you have it here and how good you have it to express your opinions.

It's obvious you've been drinking too much Koo-laid from television, the reason why Immigrants still come here is because Hollywood films lie to them that America is a great country and by the time they get here, some of them have sold their houses back home and can't face the shame of going back, you don't know how many immigrants I've met personally especially the male immigrants who tell me how they regret ever moving to America, but can't go back because now they have nothing to go back to since they sold their belongings.

+1. That was similar to what was gonna be my response.

Unfortunately, many foreigners abroad are still fooled by the "american dream" bullshit they are fed through the american media. In reality, america only offers the american nightmare. Undoubtedly living in america is better than living in some countries such as Pakistan or Somalia, but in terms of civil liberties, social safety net, and social life, the self-proclaimed land of opportunity comes in dead last when compared to other developed first world (and even some second world) nations.

I've been abroad a few times, in fact I'm in Canada now. Canada has even more peace and freedom than the u.s. The u.s. is not the greatest, freest country in the world, and never was, contrary to what they tell you. Other first (and some second) world nations actually have more freedoms and privileges.

[Temprano26]

So Halwick, doesn't Denmark have a better social safety net and free education and healthcare?

[TopSpruce]

Well, ten years ago, php discussion boards were already on the internet, talking about expatriating. By then, it was obvious that the country (and the women) had gone downhill.

What's diffferent now is that the problems have become even more glaring, and easier to notice. We could go back decades and point to numerous sources, but I'd say September 11, 2001 really got the ball rolling, accelerating the misery and corruption the country is experiencing today.

I think it started in the mid to late 80s and 90s that it got bad.
By the 80s you had mail order bride magazines, and those went onto the internet later on.


At about this time (80s) you can see the large decrease in % of married 20-25 year olds according to census statistics.
It led to Russian brides in the mid to late 90s, and PUA movement of the late 90s early 2000s and continues today with people like Winston, Roosh, and other bloggers.

I honestly wish it wasn't so bad. I remember the 90s with fondness....but yeah, I guess you have to move on. Nothing stays good forever and changing country is a thing that has to be done these days.


Of course, that's simply my opinion. Others state that the decline came much earlier and others state that civilization always sucked. I tend to agree that traditionalism is a much better lifestyle. The more traditional and less modern places I have been to have usually made me happier. So...I think the decline may have started when they switched to agriculture instead of hunter-gathering,

Best to just go abroad and enjoy life however you can.
Good luck to everyone, I'll be checking in from time to time.

[Cornfed]

The seeds of destruction were sown a long time ago, but when things really started to go downhill for the average Western Joe was the 1980s, when a lot of horrible things started to happen at once. People were put under financial distress with increasing debt and declining job opportunities. Wealth gravitated to the parasitical elite, leaving most people with nothing. The war on men in the form of bullshit rape, sexual harassment and domestic violence allegations was dramatically ramped up. Affirmative action for females and dysgenics, with the resulting devastation was ramped up. Crime increased as the first wave of malsocialized bastards of solo mothers hit the streets and blacks were allowed unfettered access to human areas. Illegal immigration with the resulting problems increased. Females, already sluts, became more hypergamous and nasty. And so on.