Philippines' killjoy truth (note to self)

[publicduende]

A polite update to give you yet another glimpse behind the curtains of the complex interplay (not!) of forces at play behind a Filipina "loving" a foreigner.

I hope someone won't see this as a braggadocio moment (I won't post any more pictures of her, nor anyone I will ever date again!), but I just broke up with the cute cosplay girl, the second one. I told her, simply, that I was feeling guilty because despite liking her a lot, I didn't feel she was the kind of girl I want to be with for life. The most painful moment was when she asked me if there was anything wrong with herself or what she might have done to me.

The correct, brutal answers would have been:

- you are pretty, but you have the sex appeal of a 10 years old just out of the dentist;
- you have no other ambition in life than being my girlfriend: your family knows it and that's why they are eager to marry you up ASAP;
- your family probably wants me to be with you more than you do, but you'd never admit it to yourself, let alone to me.

Just writing these three statements, however truthful, felt like somebody doing the Mussolini headkick on my nuts. I imagined how they might have felt to her, if I had uttered them. What I really told her is:

- I am not sure anymore if I can date you, because I need to focus on my business and I will never be able to spend too much quality time with you;
- if the business fails, I will have to move out of the Philippines and rebuild my life there (not with you).

She cried but she seemed to understand. And it broke my heart as it is, because I am fully and painfully aware that B sits right at the top end of the kind of girls I could possibly ever get, at least without paying up, and without becoming a successful and rich businessman targeted by sugar girls.

Someone told me that, with a girl like her, it's "mission accomplished" in the Philippines, and that I can't expect more. Unfortunately, I know by experience what it means to be with a girl who you can't love anymore because you don't connect to, so you won't respect (not beyond a casual friendship), and whose life and feelings stayed stale while yours evolved (I am not talking about my wife). It involves continuous suffering, on both parties. One party will feel tired, bored and positively suffocated and guilty. The other will be left dumbfounded as to why this is happening, why one is drifting from the other with no apparent explanation, and ultimately frustrated and in pain when understanding that they can't do anything but being a spectator of the drift.

So I preferred to break up, once again.

This is my third attempt to actually have a gf in 18 months in Davao. The first one tracks back to November 2015. I think by now I have the clearest possible sign that, despite being in tune with Filipino culture and society and "getting" most of their ways of thinking and behaving (whether I approve them or not, it's another matter), I am not one of them, never will be and will never access to the kinds of opportunities they are having, when it comes to the inner sanctum of their society: intimate relationship with their most precious daughters.

I need a plan B, and need to execute it pretty soon. I am feeling really down and depressed, and this could not come at a worse time: a time where we have multiple promising leads with Filipino banks, financial institutions and large companies (including the likes of Century Properties), two more projects starting and one major UK fintech to nurse in the short term. The company needs me at my sharpest, and all I can think is...whom I shall give my kingdom (if it ever raises from its foundations), whose name I will dedicate it to.

Grim state of affairs. Note to self and the HA collective memory:

if you come to the Philippines as an adult foreigner in your 40s, please DO NOT entertain the notion that you can genuinely win the heart of a woman who does not squarely fall into the following three buckets:

- in their early twenties, dark skinned, slender and maybe vaguely sexy to very sexy to our standards, but un/undereducated, not standing a chance to support themselves or their families, and whose families are all too keen to give away to the first foreign chicken who passes by;

- smart and mildly interesting (if nerdy) young women in their late twenties to early thirties, who were deemed (or considered themselves) too weird to be dating and mating normally; this category wouldn't be actually that bad, if it weren't for the fact that 95% of them are physically unattractive, hooked on comfort food and therefore very chubby to obese, and in some cases even drug users; these women are happy to hang out and date foreigners, even with some degree of promiscuity, because they know we have it worse back home and we will be more forthcoming about their shortcomings than local Pinoys;

- single moms in their early to late thirties, rarely unmarried, most of the time married ("pending annulment" = I will stay informally separated forever, as neither of us has PHP 250K handy to bribe the judge) and dumped by their partners; some of these women might actually be quality, with good jobs or even careers and intelligent; but again, their emotional baggage is real and a very large percentage of them are physically unattractive like category 2.

One recommendation. Always demand to see you Filipina prospect:

- without the mobile filters they always seem to use to smear away any imperfection they have;
- without their padded bras and chicken breasts (e.g. beach photo), which they always seem to use to painlessly upgrade to a B or C cup.

And with this post, my friends, I think I have reached the zenith of my cynicism and resignation, and the nadir of my motivation to even try looking for a lifetime companion in the Land of the Morning.

[Johnny1975]

Every time I read your posts, I always have a very strong feeling of confidence that I would never ever have your problems. I don't know why but I don't ever worry about any of this stuff. I believe I could have any girl I want over there, within reason (the only barrier would be with the wealthy girls, but I wouldn't want them anyway).

[publicduende]

Every time I read your posts, I always have a very strong feeling of confidence that I would never ever have your problems. I don't know why but I don't ever worry about any of this stuff. I believe I could have any girl I want over there, within reason (the only barrier would be with the wealthy girls, but I wouldn't want them anyway).

I'm happy you feel that way. That's the reason why you probably will never come here to find a girl. You don't need it.

[Zambales]

if you come to the Philippines as an adult foreigner in your 40s, please DO NOT entertain the notion that you can genuinely win the heart of a woman who does not squarely fall into the following three buckets:

That's a bit like saying; I can't run a marathon so nobody else can.

You also need to take into account that your preferences are more rigid than most. Intelligence is obviously your priority but guys choose a Filipina because they make good wives not because how clever they are. This is what they're renowned for.

You actually came across quite positive last week but now it seems you're back to square one in the blink of an eye.

[Johnny1975]

Every time I read your posts, I always have a very strong feeling of confidence that I would never ever have your problems. I don't know why but I don't ever worry about any of this stuff. I believe I could have any girl I want over there, within reason (the only barrier would be with the wealthy girls, but I wouldn't want them anyway).

I'm happy you feel that way. That's the reason why you probably will never come here to find a girl. You don't need it.

I most certainly do need to go to the Philippines. There are lots of good quality girls there. I don't know why you don't just look for one that you can converse with about a variety of subjects, even if she's not that intellectual. I made some good arguments about this previously. I understand that you want someone that won't become boring after a decade. Being sweet and nice is not enough, I get that. I wouldn't want a woman who is little more than a human pussycat. But super high intelligence is not necessary to achieve that.

I really think you're being way too picky. Is every non high-status girl over there really that intolerably dumb? What makes you think that a high status or highly educated girl is necessarily intelligent? Education and intelligence aren't the same thing. It also seems like you want a woman who is kind of like a status symbol for you. You're getting carried away.

[publicduende]

if you come to the Philippines as an adult foreigner in your 40s, please DO NOT entertain the notion that you can genuinely win the heart of a woman who does not squarely fall into the following three buckets:

That's a bit like saying; I can't run a marathon so nobody else can.

Not really: I am just rephrasing, perhaps in a more dramatic way, what some posters here have said, to come to the Philippines keeping expectations low. I made the mistake of dreaming up the perfect young Filipina, which is a very hot and scarce commodity who is reserved to the very top of the Filipino social ladder.

You also need to take into account that your preferences are more rigid than most. Intelligence is obviously your priority but guys choose a Filipina because they make good wives not because how clever they are. This is what they're renowned for.

You actually came across quite positive last week but now it seems you're back to square one in the blink of an eye.

I know, but I have tried to compromise, I can't. To me a "good wife" is not a girl who gives me semi-passive sex two or three times a day, keeps the house in order and maybe takes care of the kids while we foreigners exchange comments on how hot our spouses are with fellow foreigners over beer (I see this all the time here in Davao). That's not my definition of relationship.

But then I am fully aware that an intelligent and engaging woman will not only give more, but demand more in exchange, and will require a bigger dose of negotiations and give and take. I know many of you will probably love the peace of mind and crystal-clear role split that comes with marriage with a Filipina, but I am still hopelessly unable to compromise on intellectual/cultural engagement.

A Filipina who's pretty as well as intelligent and well educated is not so easy to find.

I am finding more and more evidence that I will never find her until I start seriously looking in Makati/BGC or Cebu. Until a few posts about I was mentioning tier-2 and 3 cities, until two of my Davao friends told me that the middle class families will always send their kids to the major cities anyway.

I am sorry if I sound quite the hopeless curmudgeon here, but I have my reasons to believe this is the situation in the Philippines. Of course I would love to be proven wrong!

[publicduende]

I most certainly do need to go to the Philippines. There are lots of good quality girls there. I don't know why you don't just look for one that you can converse with about a variety of subjects, even if she's not that intellectual. I made some good arguments about this previously. I understand that you want someone that won't become boring after a decade. Being sweet and nice is not enough, I get that. I wouldn't want a woman who is little more than a human pussycat. But super high intelligence is not necessary to achieve that.

I really think you're being way too picky. Is every non high-status girl over there really that intolerably dumb? What makes you think that a high status or highly educated girl is necessarily intelligent? Education and intelligence aren't the same thing. It also seems like you want a woman who is kind of like a status symbol for you. You're getting carried away.

LOL my God trust me guys, I am not looking for Phd-educated girls. Here in Davao anybody who studied at Ateneo or UP Mindanao (top public school) will be more than culturally equipped to engage on any conversation, find a decent public or private sector job and live their life with a purpose other than latch onto the provider status of a foreign man. There are hundreds of new graduates from these two schools alone. Yet, these tend to be kids who develop lasting relationships right into college or soon after, and are difficult to approach. They get engaged young and marry young. They are basically earmarked for success (by Filipino standard) and a life relatively enclosed to their social circle. Of course the odd foreigner may always come into their lives, especially in their professional sphere, but always as a boss, of business associate, or simple friend.

Then, of course, for many of them shit happens and they have kids or they separate from their husbands, or they have kids without being married. I met quite a few single moms or separated women who come from Ateneo and are good conversations. Unfortunately, none of them bar perhaps one (with 2 kids and an insurance manager, a real workaholic) was attractive enough to persuade me to give it a try. Plus, becoming an instant father to one, two or three kids is something I need time to process.

As I said, if your definition of a quality girl doesn't match mine, it can only be to your advantage, when you finally come over here. If you come to Davao or smaller city, you will realise that most of the girls you will ever be able to date or meet won't have an opinion about, say, Duterte or the issue of drug abuse, let alone more complex topics like climate change or the colonial history of the Philippines, which require some study and mental extrapolation. They will be, quite literally, happy to see you, have sex with you and show you what good wives they can be by cooking pinakbet or chicken adobo and washing your clothes. That's where their role stops. I can get bored of a girl like that after 10 days, not even ten years!

[Johnny1975]

I most certainly do need to go to the Philippines. There are lots of good quality girls there. I don't know why you don't just look for one that you can converse with about a variety of subjects, even if she's not that intellectual. I made some good arguments about this previously. I understand that you want someone that won't become boring after a decade. Being sweet and nice is not enough, I get that. I wouldn't want a woman who is little more than a human pussycat. But super high intelligence is not necessary to achieve that.

I really think you're being way too picky. Is every non high-status girl over there really that intolerably dumb? What makes you think that a high status or highly educated girl is necessarily intelligent? Education and intelligence aren't the same thing. It also seems like you want a woman who is kind of like a status symbol for you. You're getting carried away.

LOL my God trust me guys, I am not looking for Phd-educated girls. Here in Davao anybody who studied at Ateneo or UP Mindanao (top public school) will be more than culturally equipped to engage on any conversation, find a decent public or private sector job and live their life with a purpose other than latch onto the provider status of a foreign man. There are hundreds of new graduates from these two schools alone. Yet, these tend to be kids who develop lasting relationships right into college or soon after, and are difficult to approach. They get engaged young and marry young. They are basically earmarked for success (by Filipino standard) and a life relatively enclosed to their social circle. Of course the odd foreigner may always come into their lives, especially in their professional sphere, but always as a boss, of business associate, or simple friend.

Then, of course, for many of them shit happens and they have kids or they separate from their husbands, or they have kids without being married. I met quite a few single moms or separated women who come from Ateneo and are good conversations. Unfortunately, none of them bar perhaps one (with 2 kids and an insurance manager, a real workaholic) was attractive enough to persuade me to give it a try. Plus, becoming an instant father to one, two or three kids is something I need time to process.

As I said, if your definition of a quality girl doesn't match mine, it can only be to your advantage, when you finally come over here. If you come to Davao or smaller city, you will realise that most of the girls you will ever be able to date or meet won't have an opinion about, say, Duterte or the issue of drug abuse, let alone more complex topics like climate change or the colonial history of the Philippines, which require some study and mental extrapolation. They will be, quite literally, happy to see you, have sex with you and show you what good wives they can be by cooking pinakbet or chicken adobo and washing your clothes. That's where their role stops. I can get bored of a girl like that after 10 days, not even ten years!

You're making it sound like there are two extremes. Is it really like that? Come on surely there must be some girls who are somewhere in the middle. I don't understand how you could be having such a hard time finding a reasonably bright girl. Why not try the colleges, or some other similar environment. Just go to a college and hang around, preferably in a van. And grow a moustache and get a trenchcoat.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVcyNANK5cY[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15S0g8pG6HU[/youtube]

[Rock]

Haha, that second vid is hilarious Johnny. He looks so much like Roosh too lol.

[Rock]

A Filipina who's pretty as well as intelligent and well educated is not so easy to find.

I am finding more and more evidence that I will never find her until I start seriously looking in Makati/BGC or Cebu. Until a few posts about I was mentioning tier-2 and 3 cities, until two of my Davao friends told me that the middle class families will always send their kids to the major cities anyway.

I've been saying this for a long time already. And I'm someone who's trolled all over Timbuktu type towns and villages in Visayas, Luzon, and even Mindinao.

The girls who stay in these places into their 20s inevitably with very few exceptions have or end up having one or more of the following - 1. darker skin than they would have if they became a city girl, 2. sun damage and premature aging, 3. teeth problems cus dentists in the sticks just pull teeth out instead of doing root canals and other methods to preserve teeth, 4. brain slow down to fit in with environment and crushing of intellectual spirit 5. chronic short stature - province people are visibly shorter than city people on average, perhaps in part due to poverty differentials and resultant eating habits. 6. focus on surviving instead of thriving 7. quality flight - the best, brightest, and prettiest girls in the hinterland are gonna be drawn to the big cities or even overseas by opportunities to achieve their fullest potential in education, dating, career, and making the highest financial contribution to their families. 8. cherry picking by most qualified guys - there are wealthier local and certain foreign (often Korean or Japanese) who send out agents or friends to find the best looking province girls to wife up.

The money, jobs, education, glamour, etc. of the Philippines is highly concentrated in Mega Manila and to a lessor extent greater Cebu. It doesn't have to be BCG or Makati. Quezon City and many other areas of Metro Manila or even suburbs have big pockets of prestige, wealth, and beauty mixed in.

If you feel it's more difficult to get a local woman who you are attracted to because you are no longer at your peak, numbers game is your best chance I reckon. For that to work, you need highest target concentration which of course you're gonna find in Metro Manila or perhaps Cebu City as far as Philippines goes.

BTW, you said something which is a bit encouraging. It sounds like with some adjustment, you might be happy with a single mum who generally satisfies your other conditions. If that's the case, your prospective pool rises dramatically

Also, would you forget about Ateneo and UP already. There are dozens of decent unis in Philippines. Look for someone with a good degree from a good school, not just those from the Harvard and Stanford of the Philippines. Being too focused on those types of institutions comes across as elitist and I don't think this is your intention.

[Rock]

if you come to the Philippines as an adult foreigner in your 40s, please DO NOT entertain the notion that you can genuinely win the heart of a woman who does not squarely fall into the following three buckets:

That's a bit like saying; I can't run a marathon so nobody else can.

You also need to take into account that your preferences are more rigid than most. Intelligence is obviously your priority but guys choose a Filipina because they make good wives not because how clever they are. This is what they're renowned for.

Exactly. I'm another older guy here yet I don't believe I fit in with the above generalization as far as dating is concerned. And I'm someone who's spent bulk of adult life in Asia so I'm not wearing tourist/newbie goggles or anything like that when it comes to understanding what is going on in the minds and hearts of these women.

[publicduende]

I've been saying this for a long time already. And I'm someone who's trolled all over Timbuktu type towns and villages in Visayas, Luzon, and even Mindinao.

The girls who stay in these places into their 20s inevitably with very few exceptions have or end up having one or more of the following - 1. darker skin than they would have if they became a city girl, 2. sun damage and premature aging, 3. teeth problems cus dentists in the sticks just pull teeth out instead of doing root canals and other methods to preserve teeth, 4. brain slow down to fit in with environment and crushing of intellectual spirit 5. chronic short stature - province people are visibly shorter than city people on average, perhaps in part due to poverty differentials and resultant eating habits. 6. focus on surviving instead of thriving 7. quality flight - the best, brightest, and prettiest girls in the hinterland are gonna be drawn to the big cities or even overseas by opportunities to achieve their fullest potential in education, dating, career, and making the highest financial contribution to their families. 8. cherry picking by most qualified guys - there are wealthier local and certain foreign (often Korean or Japanese) who send out agents or friends to find the best looking province girls to wife up.

The money, jobs, education, glamour, etc. of the Philippines is highly concentrated in Mega Manila and to a lessor extent greater Cebu. It doesn't have to be BCG or Makati. Quezon City and many other areas of Metro Manila or even suburbs have big pockets of prestige, wealth, and beauty mixed in.

If you feel it's more difficult to get a local woman who you are attracted to because you are no longer at your peak, numbers game is your best chance I reckon. For that to work, you need highest target concentration which of course you're gonna find in Metro Manila or perhaps Cebu City as far as Philippines goes.

Thanks Rock, you couldn't have summed it all up better. I agree with you that Metro Manila has a lot of pockets of gentrified living: Quezon City, Mandaluyong, Ortigas, etc. I said Makati/BGC to mean the places I am most likely to hit for business. I have been to Quezon City quite often lately, but only to visit one of our major clients who has their HQs there.

BTW, you said something which is a bit encouraging. It sounds like with some adjustment, you might be happy with a single mum who generally satisfies your other conditions. If that's the case, your prospective pool rises dramatically

I have never ruled out single moms, but those I met always seem to be either unattractive, or with too much emotional baggage, or too busy with their jobs, or simply uninterested. The better ones are the ones who are still married but I am very wary about engaging them for more than a fling, and often they are too, as their situations with their husbands are far from clear.

Also, would you forget about Ateneo and UP already. There are dozens of decent unis in Philippines. Look for someone with a good degree from a good school, not just those from the Harvard and Stanford of the Philippines. Being too focused on those types of institutions comes across as elitist and I don't think this is your intention.

Oh, I know. The context there was Davao City. 90% of the smart girls I have ever met were inevitably educated at those 2 institutions. A few others were from University of the Southeastern Philippine (USEP) and University of the Immaculate Conception (UIC).

The implication arrow was the other way around, actually: most of the girl I appreciated intellectually come from Ateneo or UP, not saying the only girls I would like intellectually are those coming from Ateneo or UP.

[publicduende]

You're making it sound like there are two extremes. Is it really like that? Come on surely there must be some girls who are somewhere in the middle. I don't understand how you could be having such a hard time finding a reasonably bright girl. Why not try the colleges, or some other similar environment. Just go to a college and hang around, preferably in a van. And grow a moustache and get a trenchcoat.

[...videos snipped...]

For now, this has been my experience. I am trying hard to find a scenario where I might spend enough free time in Manila or even here in Cebu (where I am at the minute) to seriously look for a girl who matches my expectations. As Rock said, I am well past my prime and looking for the right woman, even here in the Philippines, will be extra hard, harder than what I can afford right now.

And that's why, as I stated on an earlier post, if finding a young Pinay who ticks my boxes had been my only intention, the best thing I could have done is to keep my job and financial security in London, prepare a detailed plan of action, perhaps get to know two or four girls on Facebook, or via referrals, and meet them on a 2 or 3 weeks trip.

LOL I don't really see myself hanging around colleges buying lumpia and ice cream to girls in uniform. Consider than the bigger/better colleges here have campuses guarded by security. If you don't belong to student or staff or have business in there (proven by a letter of invitation), they won't let you in. And consider that a third up to a half of the student population is underage. No thank you

[Jonny Law]

"And with this post, my friends, I think I have reached the zenith of my cynicism and resignation, and the nadir of my motivation to even try looking for a lifetime companion in the Land of the Morning."

Maybe if you weren't RETARDED you would listen to your friends.
But you are Retarded. So there is no hope for you

Dear Publicduende,

You are the male equivalent of a STUPID FEMALE BITCH looking for Mr. Perfect who dies not exist.
My Advice
1. Ms. Perfect does not exist. And if she did exist you would still find something to complain about and dump her.
2. Enjoy being alone and lonely.

[publicduende]

"And with this post, my friends, I think I have reached the zenith of my cynicism and resignation, and the nadir of my motivation to even try looking for a lifetime companion in the Land of the Morning."

Maybe if you weren't RETARDED you would listen to your friends.
But you are Retarded. So there is no hope for you. And there is cure for stupid just wait until you die that is all we can do

Dear Publicduende,

You are the male equivalent of a STUPID FEMALE BITCH looking for Mr. Perfect who dies not exist.
My Advice
1. Ms. Perfect does not exist. And if she did exist you would still find something to complain about and dump her.
2. Enjoy being alone and lonely.

LOL I do listen to my friends, so long 1) they act in a friendly way and 2) their advice is well meant and makes sense. Neither of which applies to this pretty moronic post of yours, I'm afraid.

If you have been steeped in bitterness due to prolonged incel spells, and/or peer rejection, and/or financial destitution, of course you will be happy to settle for the first uneducated Filipina from the province who hooks up to you for whatever reason (hint: it's neither lust nor love) and gives you what you rarely or never had. It's precisely when you've been alone and lonely and don't have much hopes left in life, that you could settle for anything.

Your ranting betrays exactly that.

People like Rock and I, who have been in the Philippines for a while and do have social circles and access to girls, we have our standards and there's nothing wrong with it. Rock has pretty unique physical standards (for SEA, at least) and is equipped with the time and patience to pursue his type in an (admittedly) much larger and varied dating pool.

I am, literally, stuck in Davao, with very little time beyond a quick browse on DIA or a quick Facebook exchange. By now I am convinced that I should be looking beyond Davao and into the top two education and business hubs - Metro Manila and Cebu. The problem is not taking a flight and booking a hotel, it's having the free time and peace of mind to do it.

It will come, in time. In the meantime please allow me to throw my occasional grovelling here, like most members do or have done in different moments of their lives on this forum. If you want to be sympathetic to me, fine. If you don't want to, I won't be ignoring you (in fact I am replying), but don't expect a river of respect!

Certainly I am not looking for Ms Perfect. I actually suggested to go have a look in tier-2 and 3 cities (like Iligan or Dumaguete) but after talking to my Filipino friends I realise it's a hopeless exercise: the best and brightest (and prettiest) always leave to the larger and largest cities, leaving the uneducated simpletons ashore. Of course there might be the odd exception and a foreigner is more of a novelty over there, and a coveted prize for many of the poor families. Yet, unless you have a lot of time to invest, it might be probably better to stick to the large cities where the girls are better all-round intellectually and physically, albeit harder to get.