Russia's Invasion of Ukraine, aka "Putin's Special Operation"

[Natural_Born_Cynic]

The U.S refuse to give $60 billion aid to Ukraine. Ukraine seeks alternative source of funding.
Russian T-72 destroys U.S abrams.

This is a good analysis. Yeah even if Ukraine got the 60 billion dollars, it's not going to make a difference and is just more money wasted. Plus Ukraine doesn't have the manpower anyway. They are conscripting old men and young boys into the army, which is a bad sign of desperation, according to Scott Ritter and Col. Douglas Macgregor. Throwing more money at them isn't going to do anything or solve the problem. This is a hopeless situation.

Exactly! My god! Why can't those Western NPCs and some people in this website understands this? It's like I am talking to a brick wall here.

Ukraine is f*cked whether NATO, America, NPCs, and some people in this website likes it or not. Accept it. That's reality.
Russia has seven times the wartime production capacity then NATO, trillions of dollar worth of oil and natural gas, ongoing trade with China, North Korea, Iran, rest of South America, Africa, India, and nuclear weapons. Ukraine doesn't even have a single weapons or munition factory in their country and have to use second hand western junk and have to haul it repair depot in Poland for repairs.

[Natural_Born_Cynic]

@Yohan and @Voyager1:

I don't understand something. Why didn't Ukraine just remain neutral as Putin wanted, so this war would have been avoided completely? Very simple. Ukraine was neutral for a long time. Why change it? Is it really worth the lives of thousands of people just to get Ukraine into NATO? Isn't this war unnecessary? Isn't all this basic common sense? What is the problem exactly?

The problem is exactly Russia!

Russia would invade Ukraine anyway, despite it promised there is no such intention - but one week later the invasion started.
Next might be Moldovia, if NATO is not helping these countries to fight back.

Finland and Sweden were also threatened with military actions, and the Baltic small countries know they could also be attacked any time.
Armenia and Georgia are also hoping for EU and NATO membership.

However the Russian invasion failed and the Ukrainian government is still in power and is fighting back - Russia did not expect such a strong response from Ukraine und NATO and such a huge support for Ukraine from more than 30 countries, which all are sending materials into Ukraine to help their citizens to fight it out.

Here in Japan there are daily provocations by Russian warplane entering Japan, and since WWII there is no peace treaty with Russia.
After WWII Russia wanted a divided Japan 50/50 similar to West/East Germany, but it did not work out.
Of course Russia supports also North Korea with military technology to produce rockets which are sent from time to time in direction to Japan.

Korea was unlucky and it is still divided in North and South with no solution in sight. Russia sent in more than 70.000 soldiers to help to create a Korea, which would be only North Korea, but with USA help it did not fully work out, result was only 50/50, South Korea does still exist.

If Ukraine promised to be neutral, then what is the problem? What is Putin's basis for the invasion then? It doesn't make sense. Prof. Mearsheimer said that Ukraine was already a de facto member of NATO even if it wasn't a member on paper. That's why Putin invaded, because he saw that. Btw, in the Munk debate above, the US ambassador Michael McFaul and the Polish ambassador made the same points you did above. They were very eloquent. You should see the debate and hear from both sides. It's very interesting and informative.

Yep! That's all Ukraine had to do! but they chose THE WORST OPTION AVAILABLE. That's what they get when they elected a CIA plant, comedian who is a homosexual deviant. Oh the irony. Epic fail. A greek tragedy.

[have2fly]

@have2fly

I was addressing to Yohan, not you. Where the f*ck did you come from?

You are incorrect on Macron deploying troops near Ukraine. There is a ongoing protest in Paris about that and the French government has refused Macron's request to deploy troops in Ukraine.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/articl ... 032_7.html

Defense Minister Sebastien Lecornu however, said the furor caused by Macron's initial remarks after a conference of Ukraine's European allies on February 26 was due to them being "taken out of context". "There were hypotheses clearly put on the table but not combat ground troops as may have been said here or there," he told broadcaster BFMTV, noting that Macron had reaffirmed that France would not be a "co-belligerent" in the conflict.

You are another politically correct maggot and NPC cuck dumbass who thinks America is holding World Peace. That's funny. America act out on it's own interest. Holding World Peace is just a veil for America to exploit most of the world's natural resources and exercising it's dominance through fear via economic sanctions, and immense fire power. If you call hundred years of America's global imperialist war mongering and predatory capitalism "World Peace" then you have a serious case of cognitive dissonance my friend.

I have been on this forum since 2008. Where the f*ck did you come from is a better question.
What maga-cucks like you fail to understand is that there is not a better alternative to US global enforcement and international laws that exist today. Capitalism is predatory, sure. You want everyone to live communist Chinese style? Do you like Venezuela style? All developed capitalist countries are the ones that drive innovation and global quality of life improvements with increased life expectancy, better public education and actual chance to raise from the poverty. I personally think West European system is the best, although it is heavily abused and unsustainable, since they were able to afford amazing social welfare at the expense of American global military protection. I was in Ukraine when 2014 invasion happened, I did see the chaos and how Russkie slaughter locals just for speaking Ukrainian. People like you just have no clue. And no, I am in no way politically correct at all. I see BS gender wars in Western countries and how femi-nazis destroyed normal way of life in the West. But electing orange monkey or sucking up to Russia will not change anything.

You are the only one with cognitive dissonance, just as all Drump cucks. Orange shithead is being paid off by Russkie regime officially right now. Did you ever live in Russia outside of Moscow? It is third world level of life with no roads, no jobs and no hope. Do you really want this shitty lifestyle to spread all over the world? Russia lives in "1984", all political agenda is controlled, everyone is a slave of the system, including even those rich and powerful. Corruption is a way of life. Rule of law is absent - you may come back home to see your home already sold by some fake realtor, when you go to police you find out they are also participating. You have no protection, no security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your investment, property, savings, pensions or retirement funds. Life in Russia is a constant trap, but again insecure maga-idiots enjoying all legal protections under current system think you will gain something from destroying the current system and somehow letting Russia and China take over the world? If Russia and China take over, they will just bring more misery, slavery and destruction with them. And no, you ain't going to be a part of top 0.1% ruling class who will live in safety.

[have2fly]

@Yohan and @Voyager1:

I don't understand something. Why didn't Ukraine just remain neutral as Putin wanted, so this war would have been avoided completely? Very simple. Ukraine was neutral for a long time. Why change it? Is it really worth the lives of thousands of people just to get Ukraine into NATO? Isn't this war unnecessary? Isn't all this basic common sense? What is the problem exactly?

The problem is exactly Russia!

Russia would invade Ukraine anyway, despite it promised there is no such intention - but one week later the invasion started.
Next might be Moldovia, if NATO is not helping these countries to fight back.

Finland and Sweden were also threatened with military actions, and the Baltic small countries know they could also be attacked any time.
Armenia and Georgia are also hoping for EU and NATO membership.

However the Russian invasion failed and the Ukrainian government is still in power and is fighting back - Russia did not expect such a strong response from Ukraine und NATO and such a huge support for Ukraine from more than 30 countries, which all are sending materials into Ukraine to help their citizens to fight it out.

Here in Japan there are daily provocations by Russian warplane entering Japan, and since WWII there is no peace treaty with Russia.
After WWII Russia wanted a divided Japan 50/50 similar to West/East Germany, but it did not work out.
Of course Russia supports also North Korea with military technology to produce rockets which are sent from time to time in direction to Japan.

Korea was unlucky and it is still divided in North and South with no solution in sight. Russia sent in more than 70.000 soldiers to help to create a Korea, which would be only North Korea, but with USA help it did not fully work out, result was only 50/50, South Korea does still exist.

If Ukraine promised to be neutral, then what is the problem? What is Putin's basis for the invasion then? It doesn't make sense. Prof. Mearsheimer said that Ukraine was already a de facto member of NATO even if it wasn't a member on paper. That's why Putin invaded, because he saw that. Btw, in the Munk debate above, the US ambassador Michael McFaul and the Polish ambassador made the same points you did above. They were very eloquent. You should see the debate and hear from both sides. It's very interesting and informative.

Prof. Mearsheimer? The idiot who called for "Finlandization" of Ukraine in his lecture right before the war had started in 2022? He meant that Finland stayed neutral and friendly to the West and Russia since WWII, of course. Yeah, we all know how it turned out and that Finlandization now means joining NATO. No Winston, Ukraine was not de-facto NATO before the war. It is complete BS. Ukraine was completely independent on paper, but constantly swayed by Russia to stay in its orbit. However, Russia did not offer any alternative outside of Ukraine being its colony. But Ukrainians wanted more stability, prosperity and Western style rule of law, but Russia did not like that, so they started a proxy war in 2014 and expanded in 2022 just to keep Ukraine de-facto a part of Russia.

[have2fly]

The U.S refuse to give $60 billion aid to Ukraine. Ukraine seeks alternative source of funding.
Russian T-72 destroys U.S abrams.

This is a good analysis. Yeah even if Ukraine got the 60 billion dollars, it's not going to make a difference and is just more money wasted. Plus Ukraine doesn't have the manpower anyway. They are conscripting old men and young boys into the army, which is a bad sign of desperation, according to Scott Ritter and Col. Douglas Macgregor. Throwing more money at them isn't going to do anything or solve the problem. This is a hopeless situation.

It will absolutely make a huge difference. It will allow to procure new Western weapons that will not even require manpower, such as millions of drones. Money spent on Ukraine is actually well-spent, because when Ukraine fails we will be spending 600 billion instead of 60 billion to fight Russia in the Baltic states and Poland using our troops and our allied troops. How is this better for anyone? 90 percent of this money will also stay in the US and NATO, which will allow to create jobs and expand Western manufacturing.

[have2fly]

@Yohan and @Voyager1:

I don't understand something. Why didn't Ukraine just remain neutral as Putin wanted, so this war would have been avoided completely? Very simple. Ukraine was neutral for a long time. Why change it? Is it really worth the lives of thousands of people just to get Ukraine into NATO? Isn't this war unnecessary? Isn't all this basic common sense? What is the problem exactly?

Winston, are you seriously this naive? Ukraine was independent since 1991, but de-facto a part of Russia. As soon as Ukraine tried to actually politically drift away to actually gain real independence, Russia started a proxy war in 2014. No one is pushing Ukraine into NATO. Who was pushing Baltic states to join NATO in 1990's? Anyone pushed Poland? But they were lucky, because Moldova and Georgia were unable to do so because of Russian proxy wars. The situation in Ukraine is no different than Moldova in 1990-1992 Transnistria conflict. Russia keeps using its claim that someone is hurting Russian speakers and they need protection. Just like Germans in the Sudetes needed protection by Hitler, while American congress was constantly calling for non-involvement into "the conflict in Europe" in 1939 seeing that USSR and Nazi Germany are jointly dividing Europe, but then Germany decided it wants all of Europe for themselves and the Soviets would've lost the war without American logistical supplies. But "lend-lease" program was completely banned from history text-books in Soviet Union. I had no idea about it growing up. I also had no idea USSR and Nazi Germany were allies until 1941. I was taught fake history growing up in Eastern Ukraine since they used Soviet history textbooks. The history is repeating itself yet again, Russia wants to occupy a part of Europe, but now Germany is on the right side.

[have2fly]

@Yohan

Japan and South Korea also offer support for Ukraine, both were quickly put on the 'unfriendly countries list' by Putin.

Both countries shouldn't have supported the Ukrainistan sinkhole. Now they get no cheap Russian natural gas and oil. Bad move by both. They should've stayed neutral.

Neither Japan nor South Korea are neutral countries and both feel threatened by Russia (and protected by USA)

South Korea would not even exist if Russia could decide it, only North Korea would be on the map.

About Japan, Russia was always a threat and it is provoking Japan with warplanes entering Japan every single day.
Japan would be a divided country after WWII with no hope to unify again - similar to North/South Korea.

Japan found other suppliers which are willing to export more energy related materials into Japan, for example Australia and Indonesia....
Policy is about to cut down any relationship with Russia to the bare minimum.

A military weak Russia is only good for South Korea and Japan. With less support from Russia to North Korea it makes this region where I am living now safer.

Yohan, I completely agree with you and all of your posts. You sound experienced, educated, logical and well-traveled. You see this situation from Japan, I look at it from educated Ukrainian point of view. I had no idea that we were blessed to live through our lives since 1945 in relative peace and stability, while also maintaining rule of law, free trade, international cooperation and security of travel.

[Natural_Born_Cynic]

@have2fly

I have been on this forum since 2008. Where the f*ck did you come from is a better question.

Yes.. yes.. to be clear, I was having a debate with Yohan, but you came in and called me a "dumbass". Do you have a habit of popping out in the middle of the debate and insulting people you don't agree with? That's why I asked "where the f*ck did you came from."

What maga-cucks like you fail to understand is that there is not a better alternative to US global enforcement and international laws that exist today. Capitalism is predatory, sure. You want everyone to live communist Chinese style? Do you like Venezuela style? All developed capitalist countries are the ones that drive innovation and global quality of life improvements with increased life expectancy, better public education and actual chance to raise from the poverty. I personally think West European system is the best, although it is heavily abused and unsustainable, since they were able to afford amazing social welfare at the expense of American global military protection. I was in Ukraine when 2014 invasion happened, I did see the chaos and how Russkie slaughter locals just for speaking Ukrainian. People like you just have no clue. And no, I am in no way politically correct at all. I see BS gender wars in Western countries and how femi-nazis destroyed normal way of life in the West. But electing orange monkey or sucking up to Russia will not change anything.

F*ck you, you mega cuck. I didn't advocate for Russian style, Chinese style, or Venezuelan style in any part of this thread. WTF are you talking about? Are you on the crack pipe? Sure.. Western American style is the lesser of two evils and Western American style sure grants lot of people with lot of great opportunities. I don't deny that. My main premise/theme is that "Ukraine is f*cked whether NATO/West, you and others like it or not." That is my main premise and I didn't say anything about adopting communism or totalitarianism. If you don't like what I am saying then f*ck off.

You are the only one with cognitive dissonance, just as all Drump cucks. Orange shithead is being paid off by Russkie regime officially right now. Did you ever live in Russia outside of Moscow? It is third world level of life with no roads, no jobs and no hope. Do you really want this shitty lifestyle to spread all over the world? Russia lives in "1984", all political agenda is controlled, everyone is a slave of the system, including even those rich and powerful. Corruption is a way of life. Rule of law is absent - you may come back home to see your home already sold by some fake realtor, when you go to police you find out they are also participating. You have no protection, no security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your investment, property, savings, pensions or retirement funds. Life in Russia is a constant trap, but again insecure maga-idiots enjoying all legal protections under current system think you will gain something from destroying the current system and somehow letting Russia and China take over the world? If Russia and China take over, they will just bring more misery, slavery and destruction with them. And no, you ain't going to be a part of top 0.1% ruling class who will live in safety.

You too. And I didn't post anything about Donald Trump is the Greatest thing since sliced bread or being orange Jesus, you retard.
And have you ever lived in Detroit, Cleveland Ohio, Paterson NJ or Compton LA? There are no roads, no jobs, lot of gangbangers, drug dealers, and no hope at all. Everything in America is over regulated, corporations are acting like feudal lords watching over their employee/serf's every move, and Rule of Law can be circumvented with enough political connections and lobbying in America. You have very little protection, security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your assets. Big corporations and big government can f*ck over the little guys and there is no recourse for the little guys. However, America wants you to believe that American Dream marketing propaganda sh*t. Life in America is constant trap. Even Winston Wu said so, if you have been here since 2008 then you would know. I am not saying Chinese and Russian way of doing things are better. They are just as worst.
American style is just lesser of two evils.

[Natural_Born_Cynic]

@Yohan

Japan and South Korea also offer support for Ukraine, both were quickly put on the 'unfriendly countries list' by Putin.

Both countries shouldn't have supported the Ukrainistan sinkhole. Now they get no cheap Russian natural gas and oil. Bad move by both. They should've stayed neutral.

Neither Japan nor South Korea are neutral countries and both feel threatened by Russia (and protected by USA)

South Korea would not even exist if Russia could decide it, only North Korea would be on the map.

About Japan, Russia was always a threat and it is provoking Japan with warplanes entering Japan every single day.
Japan would be a divided country after WWII with no hope to unify again - similar to North/South Korea.

Japan found other suppliers which are willing to export more energy related materials into Japan, for example Australia and Indonesia....
Policy is about to cut down any relationship with Russia to the bare minimum.

A military weak Russia is only good for South Korea and Japan. With less support from Russia to North Korea it makes this region where I am living now safer.

Yohan, I completely agree with you and all of your posts. You sound experienced, educated, logical and well-traveled. You see this situation from Japan, I look at it from educated Ukrainian point of view. I had no idea that we were blessed to live through our lives since 1945 in relative peace and stability, while also maintaining rule of law, free trade, international cooperation and security of travel.

So your Ukrainian? No wonder you are triggered about Russians pounding your "Khokhol" countrymen to dust with their Artillery strikes.
I definitely feel you... Slava Ukraini! Zelensky should beg for more crumbs from America and pals.

[have2fly]

@have2fly

I have been on this forum since 2008. Where the f*ck did you come from is a better question.

Yes.. yes.. to be clear, I was having a debate with Yohan, but you came in and called me a "dumbass". Do you have a habit of popping out in the middle of the debate and insulting people you don't agree with? That's why I asked "where the f*ck did you came from."

What maga-cucks like you fail to understand is that there is not a better alternative to US global enforcement and international laws that exist today. Capitalism is predatory, sure. You want everyone to live communist Chinese style? Do you like Venezuela style? All developed capitalist countries are the ones that drive innovation and global quality of life improvements with increased life expectancy, better public education and actual chance to raise from the poverty. I personally think West European system is the best, although it is heavily abused and unsustainable, since they were able to afford amazing social welfare at the expense of American global military protection. I was in Ukraine when 2014 invasion happened, I did see the chaos and how Russkie slaughter locals just for speaking Ukrainian. People like you just have no clue. And no, I am in no way politically correct at all. I see BS gender wars in Western countries and how femi-nazis destroyed normal way of life in the West. But electing orange monkey or sucking up to Russia will not change anything.

F*ck you, cuck. I didn't advocate for Russian style, Chinese style, or Venezuelan style in any part of this thread. WTF are you talking about? Are you on the crack pipe? Sure.. Western American style is the lesser of two evils and Western American style sure grants lot of people with lot of great opportunities. I don't deny that. My main premise/theme is that "Ukraine is f*cked whether NATO/West, you and others like it or not." That is my main premise and I didn't say anything about adopting communism or totalitarianism. If you don't like what I am saying then f*ck off.

You are the only one with cognitive dissonance, just as all Drump cucks. Orange shithead is being paid off by Russkie regime officially right now. Did you ever live in Russia outside of Moscow? It is third world level of life with no roads, no jobs and no hope. Do you really want this shitty lifestyle to spread all over the world? Russia lives in "1984", all political agenda is controlled, everyone is a slave of the system, including even those rich and powerful. Corruption is a way of life. Rule of law is absent - you may come back home to see your home already sold by some fake realtor, when you go to police you find out they are also participating. You have no protection, no security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your investment, property, savings, pensions or retirement funds. Life in Russia is a constant trap, but again insecure maga-idiots enjoying all legal protections under current system think you will gain something from destroying the current system and somehow letting Russia and China take over the world? If Russia and China take over, they will just bring more misery, slavery and destruction with them. And no, you ain't going to be a part of top 0.1% ruling class who will live in safety.

You too. And I didn't post anything about Donald Trump is the Greatest thing since sliced bread or being orange Jesus, you retard.
And have you ever lived in Detroit, Cleveland Ohio, Paterson NJ or Compton LA? There are no roads, no jobs, lot of gangbangers, drug dealers, and no hope at all. Everything in America is over regulated, corporations are acting like feudal lords watching over their employee/serf's every move, and Rule of Law can be circumvented with enough political connections and lobbying in America. You have very little protection, security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your assets. Big corporations and big government can f*ck over the little guys and there is no recourse for the little guys. However, America wants you to believe that American Dream marketing propaganda sh*t. Life in America is constant trap. Even Winston Wu said so, if you have been here since 2008 then you would know. I am not saying Chinese and Russian way of doing things are better. They are just as worst.
American style is just lesser of two evils.

It is not an insult, it is conveying the fact. You are repeating every dumb word of Russian propaganda.
If you are not advocating for Russian style of life or Chinese, then what are you advocating for? International politics cannot be void of control and governance. Educated people understand this, people like you do not.
Ukraine is a war-torn destroyed country, destroyed no no one else, but Russia. So your point is? We stop helping Ukraine, just so we ourselves start fighting off Russian invaders and helping Lithuania and Moldova next? Russians are conscripting Ukrainians from occupied territories, so if all of Ukraine gets occupied, those Ukrainians will be fighting against us. Is that what you want?
Yeah, you did not post anything about orange monkey, but you repeated every single word of his BS arguments. I did, in fact, live in shitty American rustbelt cities. Some parts feel like you are in Africa. I completely agree. But 95% of Russia is like that while maybe 5% of the US is like that. You actually have roads in Detroit, even though they are rundown, but paved. In Russia you have dirt-roads. You actually have amazing protection in the US as soon as you get out of the ghetto. Big corporations own everything all over the world, so again your point is? Did I even say anything about American Dream? Life in America is not a constant trap, your property cannot be easily confiscated by local police using some black market realtor like they do in Russia. Most laws actually work in the US. You have amazing security and protection in the US, you can even live in the gated community in a place like the Villages in Florida where people just f*ck and chill enjoying their retirement. Did you ever see how poor Russian seniors are? 99 percent of them get a pension of around 150-200 dollars per month, which is barely enough to pay for their housing bills. There are no 401k plans, no decent savings and no path to survive. Grandmas are digging piles of trash for food. Russians get shocked when they see 80 year old seniors in the US driving new Cadillacs living in mansions, it is completely unthinkable in Russia for old people. In the same time Russian regime constantly scares their senior population that if they don't vote for their midget dicktator they won't get their pension. Is that the kind of retirement that you want?
Another fact is Russians are pouring through the border with Mexico, they want to live in the US and they are asking for asylum. Thousands of them want to come here. Why would they do it if life in Russia is decent?

[have2fly]

@Yohan

Japan and South Korea also offer support for Ukraine, both were quickly put on the 'unfriendly countries list' by Putin.

Both countries shouldn't have supported the Ukrainistan sinkhole. Now they get no cheap Russian natural gas and oil. Bad move by both. They should've stayed neutral.

Neither Japan nor South Korea are neutral countries and both feel threatened by Russia (and protected by USA)

South Korea would not even exist if Russia could decide it, only North Korea would be on the map.

About Japan, Russia was always a threat and it is provoking Japan with warplanes entering Japan every single day.
Japan would be a divided country after WWII with no hope to unify again - similar to North/South Korea.

Japan found other suppliers which are willing to export more energy related materials into Japan, for example Australia and Indonesia....
Policy is about to cut down any relationship with Russia to the bare minimum.

A military weak Russia is only good for South Korea and Japan. With less support from Russia to North Korea it makes this region where I am living now safer.

Yohan, I completely agree with you and all of your posts. You sound experienced, educated, logical and well-traveled. You see this situation from Japan, I look at it from educated Ukrainian point of view. I had no idea that we were blessed to live through our lives since 1945 in relative peace and stability, while also maintaining rule of law, free trade, international cooperation and security of travel.

So your Ukrainian? No wonder you are triggered about Russians pounding your "Khokhol" countrymen to dust with their Artillery strikes.
I definitely feel you... Slava Ukraini! Zelensky should beg for more crumbs from America and pals.

Another retarded Russian Nazi comment. Russians dusting off their artillery? Are you seriously this stupid? Ukrainians are not my countrymen, I am US citizen and will always be. Zelensky is a piece of shit president and a part of the reason why this war even started, but keep saying ignorant dumb shit. Maybe you will hit rock bottom one day.

[Natural_Born_Cynic]

@have2fly

I have been on this forum since 2008. Where the f*ck did you come from is a better question.

Yes.. yes.. to be clear, I was having a debate with Yohan, but you came in and called me a "dumbass". Do you have a habit of popping out in the middle of the debate and insulting people you don't agree with? That's why I asked "where the f*ck did you came from."

What maga-cucks like you fail to understand is that there is not a better alternative to US global enforcement and international laws that exist today. Capitalism is predatory, sure. You want everyone to live communist Chinese style? Do you like Venezuela style? All developed capitalist countries are the ones that drive innovation and global quality of life improvements with increased life expectancy, better public education and actual chance to raise from the poverty. I personally think West European system is the best, although it is heavily abused and unsustainable, since they were able to afford amazing social welfare at the expense of American global military protection. I was in Ukraine when 2014 invasion happened, I did see the chaos and how Russkie slaughter locals just for speaking Ukrainian. People like you just have no clue. And no, I am in no way politically correct at all. I see BS gender wars in Western countries and how femi-nazis destroyed normal way of life in the West. But electing orange monkey or sucking up to Russia will not change anything.

F*ck you, cuck. I didn't advocate for Russian style, Chinese style, or Venezuelan style in any part of this thread. WTF are you talking about? Are you on the crack pipe? Sure.. Western American style is the lesser of two evils and Western American style sure grants lot of people with lot of great opportunities. I don't deny that. My main premise/theme is that "Ukraine is f*cked whether NATO/West, you and others like it or not." That is my main premise and I didn't say anything about adopting communism or totalitarianism. If you don't like what I am saying then f*ck off.

You are the only one with cognitive dissonance, just as all Drump cucks. Orange shithead is being paid off by Russkie regime officially right now. Did you ever live in Russia outside of Moscow? It is third world level of life with no roads, no jobs and no hope. Do you really want this shitty lifestyle to spread all over the world? Russia lives in "1984", all political agenda is controlled, everyone is a slave of the system, including even those rich and powerful. Corruption is a way of life. Rule of law is absent - you may come back home to see your home already sold by some fake realtor, when you go to police you find out they are also participating. You have no protection, no security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your investment, property, savings, pensions or retirement funds. Life in Russia is a constant trap, but again insecure maga-idiots enjoying all legal protections under current system think you will gain something from destroying the current system and somehow letting Russia and China take over the world? If Russia and China take over, they will just bring more misery, slavery and destruction with them. And no, you ain't going to be a part of top 0.1% ruling class who will live in safety.

You too. And I didn't post anything about Donald Trump is the Greatest thing since sliced bread or being orange Jesus, you retard.
And have you ever lived in Detroit, Cleveland Ohio, Paterson NJ or Compton LA? There are no roads, no jobs, lot of gangbangers, drug dealers, and no hope at all. Everything in America is over regulated, corporations are acting like feudal lords watching over their employee/serf's every move, and Rule of Law can be circumvented with enough political connections and lobbying in America. You have very little protection, security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your assets. Big corporations and big government can f*ck over the little guys and there is no recourse for the little guys. However, America wants you to believe that American Dream marketing propaganda sh*t. Life in America is constant trap. Even Winston Wu said so, if you have been here since 2008 then you would know. I am not saying Chinese and Russian way of doing things are better. They are just as worst.
American style is just lesser of two evils.

It is not an insult, it is conveying the fact. You are repeating every dumb word of Russian propaganda.
If you are not advocating for Russian style of life or Chinese, then what are you advocating for? International politics cannot be void of control and governance. Educated people understand this, people like you do not.
Ukraine is a war-torn destroyed country, destroyed no no one else, but Russia. So your point is? We stop helping Ukraine, just so we start fighting and helping Lithuania and Moldova next? Russians are conscripting Ukrainians from occupied territories, so if all of Ukraine gets occupied, those Ukrainians will be fighting against us. Is that what you want?
Yeah, you did not post anything about orange monkey, but you repeated every single word of his BS arguments. I did, in fact, live in shitty American rustbelt cities. Some parts feel like you are in Africa. I completely agree. But 95% of Russia is like that while maybe 5% of the US is like that. You actually have roads in Detroit, even though they are rundown, but paved. In Russia you have dirt-roads. You actually have amazing protection in the US as soon as you get out of the ghetto. Big corporations own everything all over the world, so again your point is? Did I even say anything about American Dream? Life in America is not a constant trap, your property cannot be easily confiscated by local police using some black market realtor like they do in Russia. Most laws actually work in the US. You have amazing security and protection in the US, you can even live in the gated community in a place like the Villages in Florida where people just f*ck and chill enjoying their retirement. Did you ever see how poor Russian seniors are? 99 percent of them get a pension of around 150-200 dollars per month, which is barely enough to pay for their housing bills. There are no 401k plans, no decent savings and no path to survive. Grandmas are digging piles of trash for food. Russians get shocked when they see 80 year old seniors in the US driving new Cadillacs living in mansions, it is completely unthinkable in Russia for old people. In the same time Russian regime constantly scares their senior population that if they don't vote for their midget dicktator they won't get their pension. Is that the kind of retirement that you want?
Another fact is Russians are pouring through the border with Mexico, they want to live in the US and they are asking for asylum. Thousands of them want to come here. Why would they do it if life in Russia is decent?

I am conveying my facts too.
I am not a trump supporter, and I am not a Russian Z-bot either. My premise still stands whether you and Yohan likes it or not. The earlier you accept, the better.

Ask Winston Wu and others about living in America and American law. You will find all of them hating on America constantly.

Not all old people live in Florida Mansions and drive expensive Cadillacs. Come on, get real. Probably some corporate CEO, Wall street banker, real estate mogul sharks who ripped off the little guys enjoying their retirement at the expense of the masses.

And even if you paid off the mortgage of your home, the local town still owns the land under your property. If you don't pay property tax every year even by couple of cents, then the town can put a "lien" on your property and take it away.

American healthcare cost is a nightmare, tens of millions file for medical bankruptcy and I've seen plenty of elderly homeless freezing to death too.
Laws can be rewritten and amended for the benefits of big corporations and American police mostly shoot, arrest first and then ask questions later.

I don't deny Russia has serious problems too, but America isn't all sunshine and rainbows either.

[Natural_Born_Cynic]

@Yohan

Both countries shouldn't have supported the Ukrainistan sinkhole. Now they get no cheap Russian natural gas and oil. Bad move by both. They should've stayed neutral.

Neither Japan nor South Korea are neutral countries and both feel threatened by Russia (and protected by USA)

South Korea would not even exist if Russia could decide it, only North Korea would be on the map.

About Japan, Russia was always a threat and it is provoking Japan with warplanes entering Japan every single day.
Japan would be a divided country after WWII with no hope to unify again - similar to North/South Korea.

Japan found other suppliers which are willing to export more energy related materials into Japan, for example Australia and Indonesia....
Policy is about to cut down any relationship with Russia to the bare minimum.

A military weak Russia is only good for South Korea and Japan. With less support from Russia to North Korea it makes this region where I am living now safer.

Yohan, I completely agree with you and all of your posts. You sound experienced, educated, logical and well-traveled. You see this situation from Japan, I look at it from educated Ukrainian point of view. I had no idea that we were blessed to live through our lives since 1945 in relative peace and stability, while also maintaining rule of law, free trade, international cooperation and security of travel.

So your Ukrainian? No wonder you are triggered about Russians pounding your "Khokhol" countrymen to dust with their Artillery strikes.
I definitely feel you... Slava Ukraini! Zelensky should beg for more crumbs from America and pals.

Another retarded Russian Nazi comment. Russians dusting off their artillery? Are you seriously this stupid? Ukrainians are not my countrymen, I am US citizen and will always be. Zelensky is a piece of shit president and a part of the reason why this war even started, but keep saying ignorant dumb shit. Maybe you will hit rock bottom one day.

Here,
Slava Ukraini! Bow to your leader.

[have2fly]

@have2fly

I have been on this forum since 2008. Where the f*ck did you come from is a better question.

Yes.. yes.. to be clear, I was having a debate with Yohan, but you came in and called me a "dumbass". Do you have a habit of popping out in the middle of the debate and insulting people you don't agree with? That's why I asked "where the f*ck did you came from."

What maga-cucks like you fail to understand is that there is not a better alternative to US global enforcement and international laws that exist today. Capitalism is predatory, sure. You want everyone to live communist Chinese style? Do you like Venezuela style? All developed capitalist countries are the ones that drive innovation and global quality of life improvements with increased life expectancy, better public education and actual chance to raise from the poverty. I personally think West European system is the best, although it is heavily abused and unsustainable, since they were able to afford amazing social welfare at the expense of American global military protection. I was in Ukraine when 2014 invasion happened, I did see the chaos and how Russkie slaughter locals just for speaking Ukrainian. People like you just have no clue. And no, I am in no way politically correct at all. I see BS gender wars in Western countries and how femi-nazis destroyed normal way of life in the West. But electing orange monkey or sucking up to Russia will not change anything.

F*ck you, cuck. I didn't advocate for Russian style, Chinese style, or Venezuelan style in any part of this thread. WTF are you talking about? Are you on the crack pipe? Sure.. Western American style is the lesser of two evils and Western American style sure grants lot of people with lot of great opportunities. I don't deny that. My main premise/theme is that "Ukraine is f*cked whether NATO/West, you and others like it or not." That is my main premise and I didn't say anything about adopting communism or totalitarianism. If you don't like what I am saying then f*ck off.

You are the only one with cognitive dissonance, just as all Drump cucks. Orange shithead is being paid off by Russkie regime officially right now. Did you ever live in Russia outside of Moscow? It is third world level of life with no roads, no jobs and no hope. Do you really want this shitty lifestyle to spread all over the world? Russia lives in "1984", all political agenda is controlled, everyone is a slave of the system, including even those rich and powerful. Corruption is a way of life. Rule of law is absent - you may come back home to see your home already sold by some fake realtor, when you go to police you find out they are also participating. You have no protection, no security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your investment, property, savings, pensions or retirement funds. Life in Russia is a constant trap, but again insecure maga-idiots enjoying all legal protections under current system think you will gain something from destroying the current system and somehow letting Russia and China take over the world? If Russia and China take over, they will just bring more misery, slavery and destruction with them. And no, you ain't going to be a part of top 0.1% ruling class who will live in safety.

You too. And I didn't post anything about Donald Trump is the Greatest thing since sliced bread or being orange Jesus, you retard.
And have you ever lived in Detroit, Cleveland Ohio, Paterson NJ or Compton LA? There are no roads, no jobs, lot of gangbangers, drug dealers, and no hope at all. Everything in America is over regulated, corporations are acting like feudal lords watching over their employee/serf's every move, and Rule of Law can be circumvented with enough political connections and lobbying in America. You have very little protection, security, no guardians, no reliable way to protect your assets. Big corporations and big government can f*ck over the little guys and there is no recourse for the little guys. However, America wants you to believe that American Dream marketing propaganda sh*t. Life in America is constant trap. Even Winston Wu said so, if you have been here since 2008 then you would know. I am not saying Chinese and Russian way of doing things are better. They are just as worst.
American style is just lesser of two evils.

It is not an insult, it is conveying the fact. You are repeating every dumb word of Russian propaganda.
If you are not advocating for Russian style of life or Chinese, then what are you advocating for? International politics cannot be void of control and governance. Educated people understand this, people like you do not.
Ukraine is a war-torn destroyed country, destroyed no no one else, but Russia. So your point is? We stop helping Ukraine, just so we start fighting and helping Lithuania and Moldova next? Russians are conscripting Ukrainians from occupied territories, so if all of Ukraine gets occupied, those Ukrainians will be fighting against us. Is that what you want?
Yeah, you did not post anything about orange monkey, but you repeated every single word of his BS arguments. I did, in fact, live in shitty American rustbelt cities. Some parts feel like you are in Africa. I completely agree. But 95% of Russia is like that while maybe 5% of the US is like that. You actually have roads in Detroit, even though they are rundown, but paved. In Russia you have dirt-roads. You actually have amazing protection in the US as soon as you get out of the ghetto. Big corporations own everything all over the world, so again your point is? Did I even say anything about American Dream? Life in America is not a constant trap, your property cannot be easily confiscated by local police using some black market realtor like they do in Russia. Most laws actually work in the US. You have amazing security and protection in the US, you can even live in the gated community in a place like the Villages in Florida where people just f*ck and chill enjoying their retirement. Did you ever see how poor Russian seniors are? 99 percent of them get a pension of around 150-200 dollars per month, which is barely enough to pay for their housing bills. There are no 401k plans, no decent savings and no path to survive. Grandmas are digging piles of trash for food. Russians get shocked when they see 80 year old seniors in the US driving new Cadillacs living in mansions, it is completely unthinkable in Russia for old people. In the same time Russian regime constantly scares their senior population that if they don't vote for their midget dicktator they won't get their pension. Is that the kind of retirement that you want?
Another fact is Russians are pouring through the border with Mexico, they want to live in the US and they are asking for asylum. Thousands of them want to come here. Why would they do it if life in Russia is decent?

I am conveying my facts too.
I am not a trump supporter, and I am not a Russian Z-bot either. My premise still stands whether you and Yohan likes it or not. The earlier you accept, the better.

Ask Winston Wu and others about living in America and American law. You will find all of them hating on America constantly.

Not all old people live in Florida Mansions and drive expensive Cadillacs. Come on, get real. Probably some corporate CEO, Wall street banker, real estate mogul sharks who ripped off the little guys enjoying their retirement at the expense of the masses.

And even if you paid off the mortgage of your home, the local town still owns the land under your property. If you don't pay property tax every year even by couple of cents, then the town can put a "lien" on your property and take it away.

American healthcare cost is a nightmare, tens of millions file for medical bankruptcy and I've seen plenty of elderly homeless freezing to death too.
Laws can be rewritten and amended for the benefits of big corporations and American police mostly shoot, arrest first and then ask questions later.

I don't deny Russia has serious problems too, but America isn't all sunshine and rainbows either.

You absolutely are a supporter of orange monkey. What is your premise? Repeating Russian propaganda?
I know about life in America, I spent half of my life here. This forum used to be about finding friends and getting girls, this is where America is lacking. But now the world is being turned into a chaotic dump by aspiring dicktators, where you have to think about survival only. I absolutely hate old c*nts in Russia and China that think they need to destroy the world.
Not all old Americans live in mansions, but the number of wealthy old Americans is enormous vs Russia. Something like 50% of American seniors are well-off, something like 0.5% of Russian seniors are well-off.
Yes, you have to pay property taxes in the US. It sucks, you have to rely on passive income, such as investment and retirement when you get old. This is the way this system is built. Yet again your point is? Is Russian or Chinese system better?
American healthcare is the only real problem that needs to get fixed. But is Russian healthcare amazing? Plenty of Russian homeless freeze to death. So?
American police mostly shoot first? You are a complete retard. I had been pulled over dozens of times over my lifetime, including participating in huge college parties with riot police showing up to disperse the crowd. I was never shot or even pointed a gun. Maybe because I was respectful and never caused trouble? In fact I only had respectful decent interaction with American police in all states I had lived and visited. Not a single bad situation I can remember.

[have2fly]

Neither Japan nor South Korea are neutral countries and both feel threatened by Russia (and protected by USA)

South Korea would not even exist if Russia could decide it, only North Korea would be on the map.

About Japan, Russia was always a threat and it is provoking Japan with warplanes entering Japan every single day.
Japan would be a divided country after WWII with no hope to unify again - similar to North/South Korea.

Japan found other suppliers which are willing to export more energy related materials into Japan, for example Australia and Indonesia....
Policy is about to cut down any relationship with Russia to the bare minimum.

A military weak Russia is only good for South Korea and Japan. With less support from Russia to North Korea it makes this region where I am living now safer.

Yohan, I completely agree with you and all of your posts. You sound experienced, educated, logical and well-traveled. You see this situation from Japan, I look at it from educated Ukrainian point of view. I had no idea that we were blessed to live through our lives since 1945 in relative peace and stability, while also maintaining rule of law, free trade, international cooperation and security of travel.

So your Ukrainian? No wonder you are triggered about Russians pounding your "Khokhol" countrymen to dust with their Artillery strikes.
I definitely feel you... Slava Ukraini! Zelensky should beg for more crumbs from America and pals.

Another retarded Russian Nazi comment. Russians dusting off their artillery? Are you seriously this stupid? Ukrainians are not my countrymen, I am US citizen and will always be. Zelensky is a piece of shit president and a part of the reason why this war even started, but keep saying ignorant dumb shit. Maybe you will hit rock bottom one day.

Here,
Slava Ukraini! Bow to your leader.

Of course you produced yet another retarded comment. I will stand with my leader all the way.