The Fall of Eastern Europe

[yick]

If you think of being an attractive local woman in Prague - you have had every dickhead from every corner of the globe trying out their Roosh lines on you from the age of 14 or so.
Prague, Riga, Tallinn, Bratislava - name these places - stag weekend haunts and full of expats, what do you expect a local woman to do if you come sliding up her and start giving your lines in English? If she is halfway decent - she has had it all her adult life - she is sick of it. It is like me if an attractive looking Jehovah's Witness comes up to to sell me paradise, she could look like - I don't know - Taylor Swift, I want her to get lost.

If you are serious about a Czech woman then move to the Czech Republic, learn their language, get a job and make a routine for yourself so you start becoming a fixture within the vicinity and swear down there will be one woman who wants to get to know you better.

'I fly in from America for a month at a time and no woman wants to sleep with me' What a f***ing surprise.

Your mate who looks like a Ranulph Fiennes - the Aryan Hitler Youth dude, does he speak decent Czech? Intelligent white women in Europe care about this shit - try not speaking with a flawless standard of English in the states and see how many women want to date you. You'll need those millions in the bank that you don't have.

[Wolfeye]

Supposing a man WERE looking to start a life in Eastern Europe? how would one go about that? I'm not real clear on the whole "meeting people" thing, since it really only happens in certain places in certain ways in America (and they have the balls to say other cultures are regimented- these other cultures at least form more than surface-level pleasantries). How would a Slavic that never really got along well in America likely do in Czechia or Russia? Slovakia interests me, too- but I don't know much about it.

[yick]

Supposing a man WERE looking to start a life in Eastern Europe? how would one go about that? I'm not real clear on the whole "meeting people" thing, since it really only happens in certain places in certain ways in America (and they have the balls to say other cultures are regimented- these other cultures at least form more than surface-level pleasantries). How would a Slavic that never really got along well in America likely do in Czechia or Russia? Slovakia interests me, too- but I don't know much about it.

Everything about the 'Happier Abroad' experience is about making long term plans.

Now if you are an American and you want to move to Europe, the first thing is find the countries that are still open to you for the long term - that is quite a lot of Eastern Europe, Serbia, Russian, Ukraine, Bosnia, Moldova, Montenegro - a friend lived there for three months and he absolutely loved living there.

Secondly, get an education and get a degree - preferably in linguistics, English teaching gets a lot of hate on here (for some reason) but China, Russia etc have more than enough doctors, brain surgeons, lawyers, plumbers, welders etc, your best way into a 'Happier Abroad' existence is English teacher, and count yourself lucky that this option exists, I am sure there are many native speaking Bulgarians who would love to live and work abroad teaching their language - unlucky them, lucky us. Also, English teaching in Eastern Europe is where you meet loads of young, attractive educated women - and guess what - they get to know you and some of them might like you, they might tell their friends about 'Dave' their cute and funny English teacher, and he is single too...

When you find a job in the locale, become a fixture, develop a routine, go to the gym, start running a mile or so every other morning around the neighbourhood, go and have your breakfast at a cafe, find one where you can sit there and read the paper (of the language you are hopefully going to learn) at night, go to the local university for a night class in the language you are trying to learn - you will meet locals who will want to get to know you better - it is all a snowball effect - it might take months, it might take years - but what doesn't work is going to places like Prague for a month and chasing women down the street shouting declarations of love in English - they have had it all their lives basically, Prague and places like that have been saturated by English speaking jerkoffs acting the goat - from drunk Brits on stag weekends to dopey American rooshites who want 'flags'.

They are sick to death of English speaking jerkoffs coming to their city and acting the goat like they own the joint - and even if you are not an English speaking jerkoff, you are going to be tarred by association - so you have to do things a bit differently, one is learn the language - I can't state how important this is. Roosh has sold many men a lie - and women in these countries are sick to death of it. The biggest lie is that you carry novelty value because you are a westerner - you might in Siberia - but you better bring shit to the table because you know - in every country - women prefer their own men to foreigners - even in the Phillippines that will be the case.

The only difference is - in some countries (Spain and Italy) you stand basically no chance unless you look like a local - in some countries like Russia and China - you stand a fair chance with around 30% of the women.

So your job is to a) become a fixture in the locale by doing the preparation beforehand b) learn the language c) give yourself and the country time - time is of an essence in all this.

And she will come.

Now if you want loads of women and be a God - well, you have to do things to make that happen - might not happen - well, I want to run the 100 meters in under 10 seconds like Usain Bolt - I wonder if I start running 100 meters 10 times a day outside my house, will I get it down to under 10 seconds if I spend 10 years at it?

so (d) Give yourself realistic expectations - if that is to find a nice, decent woman to marry and start a family with - you will find that in Eastern Europe.

If it is to f**k as many women as you can - well - good luck.

[Wolfeye]

yick: Thanks! That gives me something to work with! I'm not looking to f**k as many women as I can (I never even got the whole "personal score" thing, since it's trying to get approval from other men based on your screwing-around ability & plenty of it is simple luck of running into the opportunity).

Do the women actually get to know you & hear out your story, as a general thing? Mine's a bit complicated & around these parts, a lot of people translate that to mean "bullshit" (as if some stories aren't actually long, complex, or simply not one they would have wanted to live themselves). Staying single for as long as I have, I worry it's going to come off like I've got some dysfunction or deficiency- even though it was purely situational & I don't have problems with women or anything. I just never clicked well with this culture & I can't very well do anything with a woman without being involved in it (kind of like fishing without being in the ocean). I'm not going to work my life away for a casual screw that may or may not blow up in my face & it would suck the life out of anything better- plus there's the increasing menace to worry about from a shocking number of angles, it feels vaguely like living in enemy territory!

I've actually got a knack for languages, but I'm having a hard time finding resources. A lot of the books don't simply explain things (ex: "here's the alphabet," "the letters are called (if they're not called whatever sound they make)," "here's what things would sound like if they were spelled like they sound in English (maybe with comparisons- that, honestly, I've found a few times). As many ESL courses as their are in New York, one would think that they'd teach other languages nearly as frequently. Even finding SPANISH can be tricky! Speaking of learning the language, do these classes generally require a student visa or can I just got to them like martial arts classes? I'll likely have Italian citizenship from heritage at some point, so I don't know how much I'm even going to need VISAs. I've also heard that if you speak English, plenty of job opportunities open up for you & you don't need experience as much because they'd be more willing to train you- is this true?

[yick]

Hi Wolfeye,

I think it's all about long term plans and strategies - if you are able to obtain an Italian passport then that is your first job before anything else. Get that sorted because the Italians can change the rules for eligibility and you will be kicking yourself forever, get that done as soon as possible - first and last.

I'm not looking to f**k as many women as I can

Just as well because most men aren't wired to be able to do it, some can circumnavigate it by going to third world countries but if you are looking to be 'happier abroad' because of a woman situation then you are doing it for the wrong reasons. Women should be a nice effect of the action you have took, not be a cause of the action.

The only reason anyone takes any notice of what any woman says is because they are young and hot, by the time they are in their mid thirties, nobody gives a shite what they say.

Do the women actually get to know you & hear out your story

If you go to places like Prague - it is a problem because young, western, English speaking male = jerk.

If you read the OP - he blames the lack of interest because he is ugly and the steroids local men are taking.

Now one thing is true, most women prefer men from their own culture. Women are the glue that holds a tribe together, doesn't matter what the tribe is - even the Philippines this is true - upper class Filipinas would never look at an expat twice, definitely like that in China, same in my country - a middle class doctor who is nice looking would never date a Polish plumber (especially one without fluent English skills) and he could look like Brad Pitt - if he speaks English like Borat then he might as well look like MattHanson1990.

Don't think they are going to be falling all over you, they won't be - but if you become a fixture in a locale, get a job which involves interacting with young locals (English teaching is the best job for that, especially in Europe) learn the language - not because there is a lack of young women who don't speak English but it separates you from the typical western, English speaking jerk that they are all pissed off with already - then you are going to meet someone who is nice.

It is about you separating yourself from the idiots, it isn't hard, it takes time though. It is all about time and thinking you are not going to be some messiah turning up. They don't care and you can f**k off home tomorrow, there is always another batch of English speaking imbeciles flying into Prague airport to cement their hate of that particular demographic. So, your job is to separate you from them.

so I don't know how much I'm even going to need VISAs

This is your job and that is to find out.

Is what you want out there? Yes

Are you going to find it hard at first? Yes

Will you get what you want if you play it out the long term? And the answer is of course - yes.

[walrusface]

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[Tsar]

Hi Wolfeye,

I think it's all about long term plans and strategies - if you are able to obtain an Italian passport then that is your first job before anything else. Get that sorted because the Italians can change the rules for eligibility and you will be kicking yourself forever, get that done as soon as possible - first and last.

I am also most likely eligible for an Italian citizenship and passport but it would cost me $6,000 USD because my case requires I have a lawyer. Should that also be my first goal before anything else?

My parents f***ed up my financial picture. Otherwise I would also be in the middle of the process of Italian Citizenship.

[livefreeordie]

If you want to believe local girls prefer local guys go ahead

If you want to believe middle class girls won't give a foreigner any chance go ahead

I'm curious if your sweeping generalisations are based on any facts or evidence or just conjecture and pity based beliefs

The ultimate loser in all this is yourself and other men who plant the seed of that negative belief system, and start to make it real, even if it isn't. The trouble with making sweeping generalisations is that everyone has different experiences, has a different map of the world , different looks, body language, dress style and personality, then combine it with every girl being different, you simply cannot be so sure of yourself that the odds are against you. Even if you come across a racist filipina you could show that you are different, and she could start to see the positive side of you and become attracted.

I can point out some of your beliefs being total B.S, for example there are tons of guys that have money that don't get laid.

I personally made hundreds of thousands recently, and that didn't really change much and actually felt like a crutch.

I've been called handsome and good looking and that also didn't help me get laid for years, and there are lots of good looking guys that struggle to get laid too.

I know for a fact I'm leagues ahead of the local guys here, in more ways than one. I'm smarter, better traveled, stronger, funnier, more caring, spiritual and passionate, even if I might not be the best looking, not to mention wealthier and more affluent. Any local girl, no matter how well off or attractive would be very lucky to be part of my life. And even if they think local guys are better that same guy is going to have other options too, and for sure he will use that, so in her mind she loses. Im going to focus on what works for me and I don't care about the small amount of racist people

Beware of the sob stories you tell yourselves, unless you want what you really don't like to become true, because this thread is full of very negative very disempowering opinions and false beliefs

Something closer to reality is that every woman is different, but most woman are attracted to attractive qualities in men, and these have more to do with who you are, your personality, your willingness to actually approach the girl, your dress sense, what you are doing in life and of course where you are. Don't be stupid and carry excess negativity and plant the seeds of your own failure

[Wolfeye]

yick: Thanks a lot. I figure I'll be able to do that citizenship thing soon, but I don't know. Got to get a few records together & it might not be get-able. Closing in on it, though.

Do you think the women there would maybe think a bit different of me if I was making honest attempts at her language & didn't carry myself like an asshole? I don't think that learning the language is some "over & above" type of thing, but I gather a lot of people think it's something people are going to fawn over them for. Maybe it's TV bullshit? I notice everything's like Dances with Wolves or City Slickers in 10 minutes or less. Maybe they think that the thinking will be: "Wow! YOU speak some of OUR language? I wouldn't have thought you'd even bother! I'm so flattered. Thank you! Really, I mean it- thank you so much!"

I remember you mentioning a friend living in Montenegro for three months, do you know any details about his stay? I haven't heard much about Montenegro, but it might be interesting. Bulgaria is catching my attention more & more, too. So does Slovakia, although I've heard you might need a little more money over there. Could you give me any info on these countries? Or any other ones in the region? I know I'm asking kind of broad questions, but I have a hard time finding more than scraps & propaganda.


walrusface: What do you mean? I just checked the prices out & they seemed fine. As far as Westernized, I don't know what you mean. Fake food? Doesn't seem like it. PC culture? At the very least not with all the muslim bullshit that's been going on. Their balls dropping off? Doesn't seem like that's been going on either. It doesn't seem like every friggin' thing is illegal, either. Or like people constantly try to find something wrong with you or ignore quality of life situations. Not trying to fly of the handle or anything, but I don't get what you mean by "Westernized."

[yick]

@Shemp was hitting sixes with his advice on here, it should be written in stone!

@Tsar - read what Frank (and I... ) have to say about what to do...

[yick]

I didn't see this at the time, apologies for replying now...

If you want to believe local girls prefer local guys go ahead

In most cases in most parts of the world, they do.

If you want to believe middle class girls won't give a foreigner any chance go ahead

If you don't speak Czech, most Czech girls aren't going to give you the time of day - most Czech women date and marry Czech men.

I'm curious if your sweeping generalisations are based on any facts or evidence or just conjecture and pity based beliefs

The ultimate loser in all this is yourself and other men who plant the seed of that negative belief system, and start to make it real, even if it isn't. The trouble with making sweeping generalisations is that everyone has different experiences, has a different map of the world , different looks, body language, dress style and personality, then combine it with every girl being different, you simply cannot be so sure of yourself that the odds are against you. Even if you come across a racist filipina you could show that you are different, and she could start to see the positive side of you and become attracted.

Though it is true some men will get more mileage with what they bring to the table - that's true back home as well, there are many men who wouldn't dream of going to the Czech Republic to get laid - in fact, they would laugh at the thought of it. Saying that - you need a few things in place if you go to a foreign country and want to get with a woman from there.

I can point out some of your beliefs being total B.S, for example there are tons of guys that have money that don't get laid.

Usually because they're not as rich as they think they are and are aiming too high and wanting swimwear models because he works at IBM and clears 100 grand a year! He is doing well but the type of men who can get women because of the money he earns - we're talking a lot more money than the average shcmuck-who-thinks-he's-loaded-because-he-has-a-good-job earns.

Some men get women because of the kind of careers they have that are fanny magnets such as doctor, pilot, professional sportsman, military officers of captain/major or above

I personally made hundreds of thousands recently, and that didn't really change much and actually felt like a crutch.

Because 'hundreds of thousands' isn't enough money to get the women everyone wants. In fact, it's nothing and you thought with your hundreds of thousands (if it's true of course...) you could get swimwear models, no, you can't.

I've been called handsome and good looking and that also didn't help me get laid for years, and there are lots of good looking guys that struggle to get laid too.

Being good looking is a factor but if you dress like a bum and have crap hygiene and are boring and a load of other factors then being good looking is not much of a help. That's right.

I know for a fact I'm leagues ahead of the local guys here, in more ways than one.

But if you can't speak to them in their language, then you're not.

I'm smarter, better traveled, stronger, funnier, more caring, spiritual and passionate, even if I might not be the best looking, not to mention wealthier and more affluent.

Than a whole nation of men? Every single one of them!

This is what we're dealing with folks, that level of delusion we're dealing with.

Any local girl, no matter how well off or attractive would be very lucky to be part of my life. And even if they think local guys are better that same guy is going to have other options too, and for sure he will use that, so in her mind she loses. Im going to focus on what works for me and I don't care about the small amount of racist people

How did it go, four years later? Probably shit!

Beware of the sob stories you tell yourselves, unless you want what you really don't like to become true, because this thread is full of very negative very disempowering opinions and false belie

I actually offered at the time a failsafe way of getting someone that will take time but it will work. Better than running around Prague talking to women in foreign tongues and expecting anything than utter failure.

Something closer to reality is that every woman is different, but most woman are attracted to attractive qualities in men, and these have more to do with who you are, your personality, your willingness to actually approach the girl, your dress sense, what you are doing in life and of course where you are. Don't be stupid and carry excess negativity and plant the seeds of your own failure

No mention of being able to speak the language of the women where he was - and do you think this guy or any other guy who runs around Prague with the other tens of thousands of thirsty chumps succeeded in getting what he wanted?

Utterly clueless.

And what did he finally do according to his final post on here? You guessed it! He went to the Philippines
(nothing wrong with that, good idea! At least he would be able to converse with the women there!)

[Shemp]

I went back and reviewed some posts here from 2016. I was still looking for normal non-paid women in Ukraine then. In 2017, I ran through a bunch of escorts until I found a keeper, then saw her remainder of that summer, 2018 summer, 2019 summer, then July 2020 until July 2021 (Year of the Great Covid Plague) then I got bored and decided to be alone for a couple months, including now. She's 30 years younger, a beauty, we like and respect each other as equals, but we are both natural loners and probably equally incapable of deep love. I'll probably resume seeing her next month.

My impression is that Ukraine has changed in past 5 years and western foreigners have less prestige now than then, but Kyiv is still very good hunting for men in their 30's or 40's, with university education and good income, who can live in Ukraine and want to marry a university educated woman in her late 20's or early 30's and start a family. There is a huge surplus here of such educated "leftover" women who cannot find suitable husbands, meaning husbands who are also educated and who have an income higher than that of the woman and who want to marry and have a family with children.

Leftover does not mean ugly, by any means. Some of these women are legitimate top 10% or higher of physical beauty, intelligence, health, etc. Problem is that women always want to marry "up". I put "up" in quotes because women literally want taller men, but also figuratively want up: equal or higher intelligence, education, income, social status. If a woman is very intelligent and has a successful career of her own, she cannot feel comfortable giving up that career to become a mother other than for an truly exceptional man: someone with a better career, equal social status, etc. Such top tier men in Ukraine often deliberately choose a lower tier woman to marry, so they can control her better, then use top tier woman as mistresses. Furthermore, men tend to marry women under age 25, and if a woman passes that threshold for some reason, maybe because the guy she was hoping to marry didn't carry through, then she becomes leftover despite being high quality.

Facial looks is one place where women will marry down without too much objection, because facial looks of children are a genetic lottery mix of mother and father genes. Consider the normal children of that monstrous looking Mick Jagger, for example. This is also why top tier men in Ukraine don't mind marrying women with average faces. Facial beauty does not necessarily transfer to children. Other physical traits and the woman's reliability as lifelong partner are more important.

Anyway, I'm not looking to marry, but even at age 60, I have beautiful women in their early 30's making it very clear that they would be delighted to marry me. But that interest is for marriage, not casual sex. For casual sex, I have to go for women in their 40's or up (some of then still beautiful), or else pay women in their young 20's (sugar daddy).

[Tsar]

I went back and reviewed some posts here from 2016. I was still looking for normal non-paid women in Ukraine then. In 2017, I ran through a bunch of escorts until I found a keeper, then saw her remainder of that summer, 2018 summer, 2019 summer, then July 2020 until July 2021 (Year of the Great Covid Plague) then I got bored and decided to be alone for a couple months, including now. She's 30 years younger, a beauty, we like and respect each other as equals, but we are both natural loners and probably equally incapable of deep love. I'll probably resume seeing her next month.

My impression is that Ukraine has changed in past 5 years and western foreigners have less prestige now than then, but Kyiv is still very good hunting for men in their 30's or 40's, with university education and good income, who can live in Ukraine and want to marry a university educated woman in her late 20's or early 30's and start a family. There is a huge surplus here of such educated "leftover" women who cannot find suitable husbands, meaning husbands who are also educated and who have an income higher than that of the woman and who want to marry and have a family with children.

Leftover does not mean ugly, by any means. Some of these women are legitimate top 10% or higher of physical beauty, intelligence, health, etc. Problem is that women always want to marry "up". I put "up" in quotes because women literally want taller men, but also figuratively want up: equal or higher intelligence, education, income, social status. If a woman is very intelligent and has a successful career of her own, she cannot feel comfortable giving up that career to become a mother other than for an truly exceptional man: someone with a better career, equal social status, etc. Such top tier men in Ukraine often deliberately choose a lower tier woman to marry, so they can control her better, then use top tier woman as mistresses. Furthermore, men tend to marry women under age 25, and if a woman passes that threshold for some reason, maybe because the guy she was hoping to marry didn't carry through, then she becomes leftover despite being high quality.

Facial looks is one place where women will marry down without too much objection, because facial looks of children are a genetic lottery mix of mother and father genes. Consider the normal children of that monstrous looking Mick Jagger, for example. This is also why top tier men in Ukraine don't mind marrying women with average faces. Facial beauty does not necessarily transfer to children. Other physical traits and the woman's reliability as lifelong partner are more important.

Anyway, I'm not looking to marry, but even at age 60, I have beautiful women in their early 30's making it very clear that they would be delighted to marry me. But that interest is for marriage, not casual sex. For casual sex, I have to go for women in their 40's or up (some of then still beautiful), or else pay women in their young 20's (sugar daddy).

What if a guy is short? I have seen short guys with sexy girls, even in US colleges. Is there anywhere in EE a short guy can do well?

[Shemp]

Of course, anywhere there are shorter women. There are plenty of women in Ukraine who are too short for me to comfortably dance with them, for example. One the other night was like a full head shorter, so 151cm versus my 181cm. Plenty of women like that in the USA too.

[Moretorque]

Of course, anywhere there are shorter women. There are plenty of women in Ukraine who are too short for me to comfortably dance with them, for example. One the other night was like a full head shorter, so 151cm versus my 181cm. Plenty of women like that in the USA too.

Shemp you're only 5 foot 5, who are you try'in to fool?