What toxic masculinity really is

[Lucas88]

Dude, I’m just as horny as you are… My sex drive is really, really high. I’ve had sex for three hours straight before, I’ve had times (not consistent by any means) where I came, maintained my erection, and came again like 10 minutes later. Sexual frustration makes me really irritable and grumpy. In high school, I masturbated on average, six times a day. I don’t do that anymore but the point is, I also have a really really high sexual appetite. You and Lucas keep on using your libido as an excuse and it’s not. My father had a high sex drive (according to my mom), MrMan has a high sex drive, my ex girlfriend has an extremely high sex drive, and I have a really high sex drive too.

I don't mean to nitpick here, but your assumptions about our motives for sleeping with a variety of women are incorrect. First, just like @WilliamSmith, I don't sleep with women for validation from others (I don't know why anybody would even think that ). I do it simply because I'm passionate about women and the feminine form. I don't even care what most people think about me. Second, contrary to what you assume, I don't use my libido as an excuse for my sexual behavior. While it's true that I have high libido, I am actually drawn to various different female phenotypes and enjoy aesthetic variety and might even be what William calls a "womanaholic" at this point. Whenever I'm in Spain or Latin America, I see so many gorgeous, super sexy Latinas with feminine curves and big butts and just want to get on them all!

But I don't even think that "excuse" is the right word here. What am I supposedly making an excuse for and in light of what purported principles? I am not part of the tradcon crowd and don't subscribe to their particular ideals pertaining to morality. I am not a religious man either (although I do have my own spiritual beliefs) and therefore don't recognize any purported "holy books" or "divine revelations" and certainly don't care about "Jewdeo-Christian morality" or any variation thereof. Also, I'm not particularly convinced that civilization is going to collapse because of my passionate love for multiple Latinas, even if certain RedPill catastrophist armchair prophets are prophesizing the imminent downfall of Western society following the alleged alienation of beta men. So I'm not really making any excuses since I don't even recognize the validity or veracity of the subjective principles about which the tradcons preach anyway.

I've touched on this point before in other threads, but it seems appropriate to reiterate here that I don't buy into the argument that traditionalism is necessary for material progress or that material progress will come to a halt in light of sexual liberalism. Sexual liberalism has existed in the West for almost 70 years now and has been widely accepted by at least three generations, yet from a material standpoint, our societies are undeniably more advanced than ever and have experienced unprecedented levels of technological innovation in a matter of decades. There is no sign that material progress is going to slow down just because people aren't getting married or have become more sexually liberal either. First, most people are forced to contribute their labor to the system through the need for an income for economic survival (so enough people will participate in the labor market anyway); and second, it is prognosticated that automation will reach a new height of development before 2050 and therefore render a large part of the current workforce obsolete. In other words, our high-tech civilization will continue to evolve at an ever-increasing rate despite widespread sexual liberalism.

In light of this I no longer view traditional marriage as even necessary from a purely pragmatic perspective. It might have been beneficial in the warlike societies of antiquity which needed high birthrates for the next generation of warriors or in the early industrial societies which likewise required urban population growth and a surplus of workers, but today in the high-tech 21st century material conditions are very different and a large population isn't going to be required for advanced industrial production. At this point sexual liberalism vs. traditionalism has simply become a lifestyle choice. I therefore don't feel guilty for sleeping with various unmarried Latinas (I never use deception or any kind of unethical tactics) nor do I believe that what I do is harming society in any way.

[WilliamSmith]

The way I see it, excessive machismo and faggotry and true effeminacy are two sides of the same coin. I’m gonna sound like a “both sides” fag here for a moment but honestly both of them are bad and come with their own problems. Effeminate men are perverts who have a lot of bizarre and creepy fetishes and don’t have what it takes to build a civilization because you need testosterone in order to have passion and ambition. Macho men are too aggressive and will plague your civilization with crime and general dysfunction because they are too selfish. They think being aggressive is a virtue and that anyone who wants to live a peaceful life is “a beta faggot.”

Above all, I wasn't ever part of the group calling you a beta or saying you had low testosterone or sex drive (I just think it's a good idea to max it out for men's health purposes): But I only like talking to you at all to begin with because I believe you about what you say and think you're thoughtful, and if you hadn't admitted how much you love sex I wouldn't bother with these exchanges to start with.

Mostly friendly response incoming below, but forgive me for first pointing out that the suggestion that hardcore machismo supposedly being just another side of "true effeminacy" is a complete load of hogwash , like when all the normies who said "we need to give up all our liberties for freedom" when the jews blew up those buildings on 9/11 and pinned it on the muzzies then said that the alleged jihadis who supposedly piloted jets into the buildings were "cowards."
Ummm, no, someone with the balls to be a suicide bombing jihadi is not a "coward." (Also, I know there's guys here who did more research on 9/11 stuff including Winston who have other theories, but even if there weren't actually pilots, real jihadis have suicide bombed the shit out of those kikes and given them what they f***ing deserve elsewhere, so at least some of them are the real deal). So on the same point: Mega macho-men are not in fact "actually effeminate," either.
If I remember rightly, even that mutant kike Bill Maher called normies out on that bullshit of calling the jihadis "cowards," but let's get toward the positive stuff where there's common ground:

So there's a sliding scale on "macho men," but there is definitely some partial truth there about what you said about how at extremes overly aggressive men who are also sex fiends have a problem with what they call "hypersexuality" and are way more compulsive and may hurt other people in following their impulses, but many of us don't go that far.
In my case, I admitted there's also an element of addiction to the obsession with women and sex where in some ways I compensate for tendencies toward being an alcoholic or other issues I won't bother to go into right now, but I know damn well I'm not hurting any one or somehow undermining society in some way by having sex with horny women (recall none of them are married or in relationships except a theoretic cases one was a "secret cheater", and I also think prostitution is not good because of worrying about girls stuck in the trade), but I won't argue anymore about that. *shrugs*
Actually I decided to start another business and start practicing as a hypnotist as well as the other two (stock trading is one of them, and I can't name the other one for privacy reasons) because I already was into that before, but you actually influenced me to start doing it more for money but also to help people (not mixing hypnotherapy clients with women I'm banging, by the way, which I'd agree would be bad), but it's also a way to put a positive spin on my obsession with the female orgasm and sex since I seem to not be headed remotely in any tradpill compatible direction.
So see? Be positive here man, you're an influencer and are actually helping a somewhat f***ed up guy like me do something positive with his life as a way to at least make my obsession with the female orgasm into something positive.

You and Lucas keep on using your libido as an excuse and it’s not. My father had a high sex drive (according to my mom), MrMan has a high sex drive, my ex girlfriend has an extremely high sex drive, and I have a really high sex drive too.

You guys lack discipline and foresight is what it is. You aren’t able to see the consequences of your actions because you aren’t directly seeing them. You are interpreting other men’s self control as low testosterone when it’s just a high level of commitment to moral principles.

No, I'll let @Lucas88 speak for himself, but I just think monogamy doesn't really work as well as traditionalists say even if I wish it did, but something like 70% I think of marriages in the Western world fail based on the fairly recent stats I read, and something like 85% of relationships end eventually (not that it is always acrimonious between the man and woman, but they still end), and in general I personally think we men are more wired for polygamy (even if that's not a workable proposition in many countries, but I mean having sex with multiple women), and women seem more wired for serial monogamy, but we can get back into that discussion later because I already had another one of those days where when there's no women on my day planner I spend the entire damn day on HA because I've just never seen anything like it, LOL.

But in my opinion, it is you who are mistaken that us having sex with horny women is supposedly causing devastating damage to society, but it's kind of a moot point because there literally are NO healthy traditional societies left at this time, even though I agree that some of the Asian ones are much better (Hungary also looking pretty good, Russia may get better and do well if they can win this critical war against the international ZOG) and I think you're right that some of them may be repairable and will survive the storm way better than others.

Also, I'm 100% sure you're right that more individual Asian women than you could choose from are a great match for you, I was just talking about the entire countries not being as traditional as you think they are, never saying there aren't more Asian girls who would be a perfect fit for you then you'd ever have time for (which is definitely true).

[Outcast9428]

@Lucas88

You keep trying to claim that automation is going to kill the need for traditional lifestyles. Automation is going to cause the complete opposite of what you think it’s going to do.

Right now, men are not demanding that women leave the workforce because most men don’t see the benefit to advocating for that. Most men don’t really want to be the sole provider. That is going to change rapidly if jobs start evaporating and large chunks of men could potentially have no source of income. I see demands and social pressure for women to go back to traditional roles in the home becoming a lot more intense because the economy will need someone to leave the workforce and many people will conclude that it ought to be women who exit the workforce.

If that happens, sexual liberalism will naturally collapse. The only reason hookup culture can exist is because women don’t need a man anymore. If they get kicked out of the workforce though, they will need a provider, so they will only be interested in marriage minded men.

[Lucas88]

@Lucas88

You keep trying to claim that automation is going to kill the need for traditional lifestyles. Automation is going to cause the complete opposite of what you think it’s going to do.

Right now, men are not demanding that women leave the workforce because most men don’t see the benefit to advocating for that. Most men don’t really want to be the sole provider. That is going to change rapidly if jobs start evaporating and large chunks of men could potentially have no source of income. I see demands and social pressure for women to go back to traditional roles in the home becoming a lot more intense because the economy will need someone to leave the workforce and many people will conclude that it ought to be women who exit the workforce.

If that happens, sexual liberalism will naturally collapse. The only reason hookup culture can exist is because women don’t need a man anymore. If they get kicked out of the workforce though, they will need a provider, so they will only be interested in marriage minded men.

The pragmatic need for traditional lifestyles has already been killed by material developments since the second half of the 20th century. This is evidenced by the fact that society has continued to progress materially and even reached unprecedented heights of technological innovation in the last few decades in spite of at least three generations of sexual liberalism. This analysis is not even controversial. Also, when I speak about the future of automation, I'm talking about the inevitability of a complete restructuring of the labor market - technologist Ray Kurzweil, for example, predicts that with current rates of technological evolution all agriculture and industrial operations will be fully automated by 2045 - and not simply about a steady progression. The vast majority of the current workforce will become completely superfluous whether male or female. This is likely the real reason for which the global elite wishes to dramatically reduce the population and implement the "Great Reset".

Of course, the Great Reset is indeed a very dystopian vision and I for one am opposed to it and hope for an overthrow of the current New World Order (indeed I believe that this will be necessary for any healthy future progression of society), but as far as high technology is concerned the cat is already out of the bag and automation will continue to advance exponentially and transform the social landscape anyway, regardless of what kind of elite is in power. From a pragmatic standpoint, the tradcon lifestyle became obsolete well over half a century ago and it really ain't coming back as a dominant force - at least not as a pragmatic necessity (although it will always still be available as a lifestyle choice for those who want it). You can dream all you like but it's just wishful thinking on your part as a traditionalist. I myself don't see any reason to believe that it will return nor do I see any indication of the collapse of sexual liberalism in the foreseeable future.

Like I said, at this point traditionalism is just an optional lifestyle choice and certainly no longer a pragmatic necessity. People like you are free to pursue a traditional lifestyle if you like and could (and should) form your own communities based on your own collective values kinda like how Mennonites do. I don't see why you have to be so hellbent on pushing your own version of traditionalism on the rest of us even though most people don't even want it.

[Outcast9428]

The way I see it, excessive machismo and faggotry and true effeminacy are two sides of the same coin. I’m gonna sound like a “both sides” fag here for a moment but honestly both of them are bad and come with their own problems. Effeminate men are perverts who have a lot of bizarre and creepy fetishes and don’t have what it takes to build a civilization because you need testosterone in order to have passion and ambition. Macho men are too aggressive and will plague your civilization with crime and general dysfunction because they are too selfish. They think being aggressive is a virtue and that anyone who wants to live a peaceful life is “a beta faggot.”

Above all, I wasn't ever part of the group calling you a beta or saying you had low testosterone or sex drive (I just think it's a good idea to max it out for men's health purposes): But I only like talking to you at all to begin with because I believe you about what you say and think you're thoughtful, and if you hadn't admitted how much you love sex I wouldn't bother with these exchanges to start with.

Mostly friendly response incoming below, but forgive me for first pointing out that the suggestion that hardcore machismo supposedly being just another side of "true effeminacy" is a complete load of hogwash , like when all the normies who said "we need to give up all our liberties for freedom" when the jews blew up those buildings on 9/11 and pinned it on the muzzies then said that the alleged jihadis who supposedly piloted jets into the buildings were "cowards."
Ummm, no, someone with the balls to be a suicide bombing jihadi is not a "coward." (Also, I know there's guys here who did more research on 9/11 stuff including Winston who have other theories, but even if there weren't actually pilots, real jihadis have suicide bombed the shit out of those kikes and given them what they f***ing deserve elsewhere, so at least some of them are the real deal). So on the same point: Mega macho-men are not in fact "actually effeminate," either.
If I remember rightly, even that mutant kike Bill Maher called normies out on that bullshit of calling the jihadis "cowards," but let's get toward the positive stuff where there's common ground:

So there's a sliding scale on "macho men," but there is definitely some partial truth there about what you said about how at extremes overly aggressive men who are also sex fiends have a problem with what they call "hypersexuality" and are way more compulsive and may hurt other people in following their impulses, but many of us don't go that far.
In my case, I admitted there's also an element of addiction to the obsession with women and sex where in some ways I compensate for tendencies toward being an alcoholic or other issues I won't bother to go into right now, but I know damn well I'm not hurting any one or somehow undermining society in some way by having sex with horny women (recall none of them are married or in relationships except a theoretic cases one was a "secret cheater", and I also think prostitution is not good because of worrying about girls stuck in the trade), but I won't argue anymore about that. *shrugs*
Actually I decided to start another business and start practicing as a hypnotist as well as the other two (stock trading is one of them, and I can't name the other one for privacy reasons) because I already was into that before, but you actually influenced me to start doing it more for money but also to help people (not mixing hypnotherapy clients with women I'm banging, by the way, which I'd agree would be bad), but it's also a way to put a positive spin on my obsession with the female orgasm and sex since I seem to not be headed remotely in any tradpill compatible direction.
So see? Be positive here man, you're an influencer and are actually helping a somewhat f***ed up guy like me do something positive with his life as a way to at least make my obsession with the female orgasm into something positive.

You and Lucas keep on using your libido as an excuse and it’s not. My father had a high sex drive (according to my mom), MrMan has a high sex drive, my ex girlfriend has an extremely high sex drive, and I have a really high sex drive too.

You guys lack discipline and foresight is what it is. You aren’t able to see the consequences of your actions because you aren’t directly seeing them. You are interpreting other men’s self control as low testosterone when it’s just a high level of commitment to moral principles.

No, I'll let @Lucas88 speak for himself, but I just think monogamy doesn't really work as well as traditionalists say even if I wish it did, but something like 70% I think of marriages in the Western world fail based on the fairly recent stats I read, and something like 85% of relationships end eventually (not that it is always acrimonious between the man and woman, but they still end), and in general I personally think we men are more wired for polygamy (even if that's not a workable proposition in many countries, but I mean having sex with multiple women), and women seem more wired for serial monogamy, but we can get back into that discussion later because I already had another one of those days where when there's no women on my day planner I spend the entire damn day on HA because I've just never seen anything like it, LOL.

But in my opinion, it is you who are mistaken that us having sex with horny women is supposedly causing devastating damage to society, but it's kind of a moot point because there literally are NO healthy traditional societies left at this time, even though I agree that some of the Asian ones are much better (Hungary also looking pretty good, Russia may get better and do well if they can win this critical war against the international ZOG) and I think you're right that some of them may be repairable and will survive the storm way better than others.

Also, I'm 100% sure you're right that more individual Asian women than you could choose from are a great match for you, I was just talking about the entire countries not being as traditional as you think they are, never saying there aren't more Asian girls who would be a perfect fit for you then you'd ever have time for (which is definitely true).

Oh yeah, I can certainly tell that you, along with Lucas are quite conscientious. That's why I don't come down on you as hard as I came down on CaptainSkelebob. Mercer and MarcosZeitola believe he could be a troll, I think that's definitely a possibility, but the persona he displays is definitely that of an amoral man. I believe for you guys though, you could easily end up reforming your ways. Even I used to have more liberal opinions, and live a more liberal lifestyle. Its like something needs to "click" and then that's when they get it. The same arguments that work on one person will not work on another.

As far as the machismo goes, I feel like traditional, healthy masculinity is under attack from both faggoty men, and guys who are obsessed with machismo. These are traits that I consider to be including, but not limited to, ideal healthy masculinity...

- Logical
- Cool headed
- Pragmatic
- Honest
- Gentlemanly
- Chivalrous
- Principled
- Monogamous
- Disciplined
- Long term thinker
- Planner and organizer
- Courageous when needed (not the same thing as intentionally doing dumb stuff in order to pretend to be courageous. Real courage is more like running into a storm in order to rescue your family, wife, kids, or pet dog).
- Passionate
- Develops leadership skills for the sake of his people and his "tribe," so to speak, not for the sake of power and dominance.
- Intelligent
- Provides for his family
- Strong sense of justice
- Sympathizes with and tries to help those in direr straits then his own.
- Has a nurturing side to those under his care
- Romantic
- Protective

This is the kind of masculinity that was promoted for hundreds of years. Different things got emphasized more under different time periods, but overall, whether we're talking about men in the 1950s, the 1700s/1800s, Renaissance Europe, or Medieval Times, this is pretty much what was promoted as good, male behaviors.

However, this kind of masculinity gets attacked by this group of men who were raised without fathers in their household and thus have an extremely stereotypical image in their heads of what masculinity looks like that looks remarkably similar to what feminists call "toxic masculinity." These men are obsessed with machismo and attack traditional masculinity specifically because they consider it to be "beta." Its like over compensation for the faggot movement. These men tend to define masculinity as the following traits...

- Promiscuous
- Aggressive, both physically and sexually
- Reckless
- Loud
- Obsessed with sexually dominating women
- Treats women as disposable, doesn't care about them
- Bullies men he considers weaker then him.
- Believes in a "might makes right" philosophy, that he is strong, and any man or woman he dominates deserves to be subjected to whatever he wants them to do.
- Crude and vulgar
- Has no interest in "feelings" so to speak or intimacy with women. Just wants to bang them.

Unfortunately, more and more, it seems this is what "being masculine" is getting defined as. A big part of the problem is that too many women are rewarding this kind of behavior and shunning the more old fashioned masculinity as "boring." Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of girls who are still into it. But the number who are is growing less and less because so many of them want guys who act uncaring and distant these days. This is a direct consequence of sexual liberalism, because women are thinking of men, more and more, as walking dildos and sex objects. His character doesn't matter anymore because these women don't want or need him to be a good father and husband. They just want a good dick, so they look for pure brute strength. This is exactly what social decay looks like, men and women both valuing one another solely for their bodies and nothing else. I'm not saying that its wrong to take human beauty into account when being attracted to someone, but one should try to be attracted to traits that signal good things. More and more, people literally seem attracted to evil. Like "I don't want a guy who cares about me, is romantic, is chivalrous, is a gentleman, provides for me... Those kind of men are boring. I want the thug who calls me a dirty whore, slaps my ass, and f***s me from behind." They always try to argue that "the nice guys aren't manly enough!" But what they are really saying is "I don't consider kindness or morals to be masculine." When you guys talk about women who allow their man to have sex with other women, I see a morally bankrupt woman who's attraction to her man is centered around his power and dominance which is why, his immoral behavior actually further attracts her to him rather then repulsing her like it should. Which is why I consider them to be immoral whores.

Nobody could argue that my dad is effeminate or faggoty but if he was a young man today, he would be called a beta faggot by this crowd because he loves expressing his affection for my mother, constantly. He is always telling her she's cute, that he loves her, how pretty she is. My dad has never slept with anyone other then my mother in his entire life, he never makes comments about other women or flirts with them or does any of the crap macho men say you have to do in order to "signal that you are wanted by other women" and crap like that. My dad isn't as "crusader" about it as I am because he doesn't believe its as widespread as I do, but he is equally disgusted by the obsession so many modern women have with sexual dominance and sadomasochism. He says it is "sickening" and "these women are just obsessed with power, whether its power through themselves or power through the man they're with."

And yeah, those kind of women, I have no respect for them. I think who somebody has sex with and is attracted to is a reflection of who they are.

[Outcast9428]

@Lucas88

You keep trying to claim that automation is going to kill the need for traditional lifestyles. Automation is going to cause the complete opposite of what you think it’s going to do.

Right now, men are not demanding that women leave the workforce because most men don’t see the benefit to advocating for that. Most men don’t really want to be the sole provider. That is going to change rapidly if jobs start evaporating and large chunks of men could potentially have no source of income. I see demands and social pressure for women to go back to traditional roles in the home becoming a lot more intense because the economy will need someone to leave the workforce and many people will conclude that it ought to be women who exit the workforce.

If that happens, sexual liberalism will naturally collapse. The only reason hookup culture can exist is because women don’t need a man anymore. If they get kicked out of the workforce though, they will need a provider, so they will only be interested in marriage minded men.

The pragmatic need for traditional lifestyles has already been killed by material developments since the second half of the 20th century. This is evidenced by the fact that society has continued to progress materially and even reached unprecedented heights of technological innovation in the last few decades in spite of at least three generations of sexual liberalism. This analysis is not even controversial. Also, when I speak about the future of automation, I'm talking about the inevitability of a complete restructuring of the labor market - technologist Ray Kurzweil, for example, predicts that with current rates of technological evolution all agriculture and industrial operations will be fully automated by 2045 - and not simply about a steady progression. The vast majority of the current workforce will become completely superfluous whether male or female. This is likely the real reason for which the global elite wishes to dramatically reduce the population and implement the "Great Reset".

Of course, the Great Reset is indeed a very dystopian vision and I for one am opposed to it and hope for an overthrow of the current New World Order (indeed I believe that this will be necessary for any healthy future progression of society), but as far as high technology is concerned the cat is already out of the bag and automation will continue to advance exponentially and transform the social landscape anyway, regardless of what kind of elite is in power. From a pragmatic standpoint, the tradcon lifestyle became obsolete well over half a century ago and it really ain't coming back as a dominant force - at least not as a pragmatic necessity (although it will always still be available as a lifestyle choice for those who want it). You can dream all you like but it's just wishful thinking on your part as a traditionalist. I myself don't see any reason to believe that it will return nor do I see any indication of the collapse of sexual liberalism in the foreseeable future.

Like I said, at this point traditionalism is just an optional lifestyle choice and certainly no longer a pragmatic necessity. People like you are free to pursue a traditional lifestyle if you like and could (and should) form your own communities based on your own collective values kinda like how Mennonites do. I don't see why you have to be so hellbent on pushing your own version of traditionalism on the rest of us even though most people don't even want it.

You are going by the assumption that humanity won't spectacularly self destruct in the years ahead and we get thrown back decades, of not centuries... life and society as we know it is awfully fragile. Conditions and life options may be subject to change and things could return to ideal circumstances for traditionalism. It will be far more brutal than anything Outcast advocates tho... think Taliban.

Well ultimately, that's God's way of punishing societies that refuse to promote moral values and start embracing evil. Evil, by its very nature, destroys itself. Then the groups who emerge from the ashes become extremely brutal in the way that they deal with the people they blame for society's collapse, which is why you get people like the Taliban.

Evil people's objective is to remove good people from leadership of a country so they can rule it themselves and exploit the levers of power for their own self benefit. Neutral/average morality people then quietly celebrate the good people getting removed from power because the evil people don't enforce all the moral rules they considered to be suffocating or overbearing on them anymore. Eventually, however, the average morality people realize that the tyranny imposed by evil people is far worse then the overbearing nature of the good leaders. Think about Communist leaders for example. Lenin didn't care if you impregnated a random woman and then ditched your baby, but he did care if you refused to hand over food that you toiled all year to harvest, that your family needs to survive.

Eventually, the average morality people overthrow the evil tyrants by force. What arises in the ashes is basically a Taliban-like leadership. An extremely zealous group of individuals who are so determined to prevent the tyrants from coming back into power that they end up killing a lot of innocent people in their determination to stop evil from taking power again. Eventually, the good people have to replace the zealots, and keep the moral principles they believed in without becoming brutal in their treatment of society's offenders.

[Outcast9428]

@Lucas88

You keep trying to claim that automation is going to kill the need for traditional lifestyles. Automation is going to cause the complete opposite of what you think it’s going to do.

Right now, men are not demanding that women leave the workforce because most men don’t see the benefit to advocating for that. Most men don’t really want to be the sole provider. That is going to change rapidly if jobs start evaporating and large chunks of men could potentially have no source of income. I see demands and social pressure for women to go back to traditional roles in the home becoming a lot more intense because the economy will need someone to leave the workforce and many people will conclude that it ought to be women who exit the workforce.

If that happens, sexual liberalism will naturally collapse. The only reason hookup culture can exist is because women don’t need a man anymore. If they get kicked out of the workforce though, they will need a provider, so they will only be interested in marriage minded men.

The pragmatic need for traditional lifestyles has already been killed by material developments since the second half of the 20th century. This is evidenced by the fact that society has continued to progress materially and even reached unprecedented heights of technological innovation in the last few decades in spite of at least three generations of sexual liberalism. This analysis is not even controversial. Also, when I speak about the future of automation, I'm talking about the inevitability of a complete restructuring of the labor market - technologist Ray Kurzweil, for example, predicts that with current rates of technological evolution all agriculture and industrial operations will be fully automated by 2045 - and not simply about a steady progression. The vast majority of the current workforce will become completely superfluous whether male or female. This is likely the real reason for which the global elite wishes to dramatically reduce the population and implement the "Great Reset".

Of course, the Great Reset is indeed a very dystopian vision and I for one am opposed to it and hope for an overthrow of the current New World Order (indeed I believe that this will be necessary for any healthy future progression of society), but as far as high technology is concerned the cat is already out of the bag and automation will continue to advance exponentially and transform the social landscape anyway, regardless of what kind of elite is in power. From a pragmatic standpoint, the tradcon lifestyle became obsolete well over half a century ago and it really ain't coming back as a dominant force - at least not as a pragmatic necessity (although it will always still be available as a lifestyle choice for those who want it). You can dream all you like but it's just wishful thinking on your part as a traditionalist. I myself don't see any reason to believe that it will return nor do I see any indication of the collapse of sexual liberalism in the foreseeable future.

Like I said, at this point traditionalism is just an optional lifestyle choice and certainly no longer a pragmatic necessity. People like you are free to pursue a traditional lifestyle if you like and could (and should) form your own communities based on your own collective values kinda like how Mennonites do. I don't see why you have to be so hellbent on pushing your own version of traditionalism on the rest of us even though most people don't even want it.

I feel like you basically ignored every point that I made. I'm not talking about the past 50 years, I'm talking about this future you are mentioning. First of all, scientists tend to predict these enormous, sweeping changes by really early years, and just like the whole "all the oil will run out by the year 2000" stuff that baby boomers heard back in the 70s, it doesn't come true. People in the 80s thought we'd be in flying cars by now. I'm willing to bet, by the time 2030 or 2040 rolls around, things will mostly look the same. Some changes, but mostly the same. Materially that is.

Yes automation will eliminate some jobs, but why wouldn't the natural reaction to that be for women to return to being homemakers? Women have a role in the home that doesn't require employment. If there are fewer employed positions to give to people, then the logical next step is to have women go back to fulfilling they used to fill but now is done half assed because corporations want too much of her time and energy to make fulfilling that role be effective.

Would you agree that resentment and anger towards sexual liberalism is more intense now then it was, say, 10 or 15 years ago? The same thing is going to happen with all liberal/feminist values. The anger towards them is just going to grow and when automation starts killing jobs, its going to accelerate. Men are going to think to themselves "you used to not work at all, why do you now insist on taking jobs that we need?" It hasn't been a problem so far because we still employ 90% of young men and the men who aren't employed mostly don't want to be. But if automation threatens to make half of the male population unemployed, there is going to be a much stronger feeling that women are taking jobs away that men need. This has happened before in history. A big part of why Italian fascism rose was because of unemployment, the fascist party said "the solution to unemployment is women's exit from the workforce." This may be difficult to do in countries like Sweden that are so committed to feminism but it could easily happen in countries less ideologically committed to feminist/liberal values.

I'm not determined to impose traditionalism on every country around the world, but I would like to see it happen in the Asian countries, in Eastern Europe, and the Southern United States. A true traditional society has much more opportunities and benefits to living in it then simply living a traditional life in a right-leaning liberal society or even a center-right, conservative society like Japan currently is. The benefits to a true traditional society are enormous. That's why so many men now love Thailand, Indonesia, and the Philippines... Because an actual traditional society gives you opportunities that "live and let live" type societies don't. Traditionalists exist in right-leaning liberal societies, but they really struggle to protect their way of life. I want a society where we can truly flourish.

That being said, liberals are always free to leave. I do not support banning emigration, ever. That being said, while in a traditional society, people should follow the rules and yes, you will propagandized with traditionalist messages because that's how the system supports itself. I am not attempting to achieve my goals through deceit, I want people to know what my vision will be like precisely so that they intimately understand its merits and support it. Goals achieved through deceit will result in a deceitful outcome.

[WilliamSmith]

There's not a single alpha male in this thread, by the way. The only man on this site who has provided pictures of himself with women is Winston. You rest of the posters here are larping faggots who get no women. No one who actually gets women has enough time to post giant walls of text about being an alpha male online. Not to mention even if you do get women it's not even a skill, it's just based off genetics (luck) anyway so it's not an accomplishment. You're also a bluepilled faggot if you base your self worth around whether women like you or not since real alphas knows what shallow creatures they are.

Hahahah, but you can't stop us:
This little jew Mercer so shrewdly saw through us fake alphas here (wow, you YHWH's Chosen are SO smart and clever, you see right through us goys when we try to get in on your tribe's game of telling endless lies, but it seems we just can't beat you at your own game, since it's in your blood to tell endless lies, but not ours).
But we posers here claiming we have internet businesses that generate some passive income (hence abnormal amounts of free time for the likes of expat research and thought-provoking longwinded discussion with interesting personalities like @Outcast9428, @Lucas88, @Pixel--dude, @gsjackson, and many more) and claim we like having sex are actually "fake Alpha males" who have never touched a woman in our life, and are "ruining the forum" with all our posing and larping since we have so much extra time on our hands livin' in Grandma's basement.
The delicious irony that I'd have expected even a jew to appreciate is that there's nothing you can do to stop us for exactly that reason: You fuckin' ugly little yiddish manginas have to go get kicked around at work in your jobs even if you pick up a little side income trolling for the Mossad or other jewish groups on HA and social media, even though you claim it's supposedly absolutely impossible to get any women in "Anglo" societies even if you have money. So while you suckers grind on that with only time for a few shitposts, I stay at home trolling Happier Abroad with all the time in the world on my hands, and Grandma takes care of all the bills so I don't even have to work at all, even though it's kind of a PIA if I go upstairs to microwave the food and she starts screaming at me to get a job and a girlfriend (but NBD since I can just wait until the old nag is asleep or watching professional wrestling at high volume on TV and sneak upstairs then so she doesn't notice me).

Anyway, he got me: I got bored talkin' shit on Discord and Instagram or whatever they're called about first-person shooters and anime, so I decided to join this forum and pose as a 41 year-old sexaholic alcoholic virulently antisemitic homophobic Anglo male who loves Black women (also Asian women, Latinas, etc, just not as much as Black women) and wants to move aboard a boat fulltime.

Tragic, really, that we're allowed on here to "ruin the forum" as fake alpha males: Just think what a wonderful productive place this forum would be if only brief posts were allowed to fill the forum with explosively high value threads like:
"PUA is a scam"
"Self-improvement is a scam"
"It's impossible to start your own business"
"It's impossible to save money"
"It's impossible to give women orgasms"
"Physical fitness is a scam"
"Nutrition is a scam"
"Martials arts are a scam and none of them work"
"It's impossible to trade stocks and the system is rigged so there's absolutely no way to make a profit on any trades, but even so it has nothing to do with jews"
"It's impossible to be attractive or get along with anyone anywhere, because it's all based on your genetics and there's nothing any one can do to improve this or anything else"
"It's impossible for anyone except born Chads with looks of steel to get a girlfriend"
"Asian men are only valued for money"
"No women anywhere in the world find Anglo men attractive"
"It's impossible for Black men to get laid anywhere in the world, especially not with White or Japanese sports and/or hiphop fanatic Gaijin hunters"
"Latinas don't like sex"
"Anglo women have no interest in sex and have infinite power over everything"
"Women have all the power in Western society, and the collapse of the West has nothing to do with jews"
"It's impossible to succeed at anything, ever"
etc
etc

But even now you exposed us, we don't even give a f**k now that you exposed us all as Rick Moranis look-alikes living in Grandma's basement and talking shit, because like that jewish swamp rat fschmidt says: We're all "complete morons" who "deserve to be executed."
So there's literally nothing you can do about us, since you yourselves are actually powerless, even though you welded your schizophrenic anti-gentile tribal deity into a perverse fusion with Zeus and "God the Creator" and shit and have got the delusion into your warped twisted minds that you're the "Chosen people" destined to rule the world even though everyone on it rightly despises you. Hah, all you can do is cry about if you f***ing little rats, hahah! I can't wait to watch the jihadis f***ing slaughter you after your anglocuck and euro warslaves are out of the picture since you wiped them out of their own sorry ass countries and killed your own golden goose who fought two world wars and a bazillion zionist forever wars for you, but without them to use as your wardogs and human shields, now you'll all get the brutal f***ing total bloody slaughtering you so truly and thoroughly deserve.

[WilliamSmith]

There's not a single alpha male in this thread, by the way. The only man on this site who has provided pictures of himself with women is Winston. You rest of the posters here are larping faggots who get no women. No one who actually gets women has enough time to post giant walls of text about being an alpha male online. Not to mention even if you do get women it's not even a skill, it's just based off genetics (luck) anyway so it's not an accomplishment. You're also a bluepilled faggot if you base your self worth around whether women like you or not since real alphas knows what shallow creatures they are.

You're on fire.....keep going.

LOL, come to think of it, on this point I'll make a little concession:
I love Winston's collages, which made me a big @Winston fan the moment I found this site after I was already doing my own research on where to get out of dodge, and ended up stumbling on an article by Winston about "Best Countries to Get Laid Overseas in 2018" or something like that, but I think some of the other guys have actually exchanged pics, but I admittedly haven't.

So OK you got me:
Don't hold your breath but at some point I promise (word of honor) to post a silly pic of myself striking a cheesy 80s muscle flexing pose, preferably with at least one woman with a nice BIG ass in the picture.
I better do it aboard my boat after I make my final purchase decision and get one (I like Catamarans but lean toward a monohull at this point because of the big cost difference + they are known to be considered lower-value, hence less likelihood of mouth-breathers climbing aboard to try to steal my dinghy or engage in armed robbery, which happens at many ports of call in this wonderful world we all share on life's journey).

You know, this promise of mine means I literally have no choice but to try to beef up a bit more to compete with @Cornfed who has put on a fairly impressive amount of mass despite being (I think) at least a decade older than me, but with me having more ectomorphic genetics even if there's some mesomorph potential there if I can stay off the bottle (which tonight I can't, in case you haven't noticed)... shit.

Oh, honest side note to @kangarunner:
It's your choice to believe me or not on other details but recalling that PM you sent me awhile ago and I assure you that I was not lying that Portland, Oregon is indeed (in my opinion) a woke shithole going down the drain and is a f***ing PIA I wouldn't recommend, as well as having god-awful traffic, high living costs, and a shitty metro area environment overall. I've stayed out of that f***ing worthless shithole for years even when I'm still on the Left Coast because of owning so RE and some relationships and so on.
But you never know who likes what place (I seem to be in the minority of people who post here who loves expensive but amazing Hong Kong, for example, prior to the imbroglio between Soros's color revolution and Emperor Xi which made it too iffy), so by all means do your own diligence and don't mistake me for being a negatoilet like Mercer here trying to discourage you if you actually really like Portland from your own experience.
(Or are you also a troll and were just trying to dox me here so Portland antifa could come after me if I actually was still in Portland, which I haven't been for many years?!?!? )

[WilliamSmith]

Like I said, at this point traditionalism is just an optional lifestyle choice and certainly no longer a pragmatic necessity. People like you are free to pursue a traditional lifestyle if you like and could (and should) form your own communities based on your own collective values kinda like how Mennonites do. I don't see why you have to be so hellbent on pushing your own version of traditionalism on the rest of us even though most people don't even want it.

A round of applause for @Lucas88 because I agree with pretty much everything you said in the past posts here, but just to be fair to @Outcast9428 he did at least say he's OK with multiple nations and jurisdictions making their own rules, kind of like the idealized concept of the US states and state's rights, so he's not hellbent on pushing his notions of traditionalism on everyone else based on what I've seen.
Fantasizing and projecting his idealism that the Philippines and Thailand are allegedly idealized "traditional" nations holding out against sexual "liberalism" when in reality they're actually two of the most notoriously horrendous sex trade hotspots filled with prostitution, easy sex, homosexuals, and worse (not to mention giant snakes in Thailand, not sure if Phillipines has those, LOL) is another story, but no need to argue anymore on that.

[Lucas88]

I feel like you basically ignored every point that I made. I'm not talking about the past 50 years, I'm talking about this future you are mentioning. First of all, scientists tend to predict these enormous, sweeping changes by really early years, and just like the whole "all the oil will run out by the year 2000" stuff that baby boomers heard back in the 70s, it doesn't come true. People in the 80s thought we'd be in flying cars by now. I'm willing to bet, by the time 2030 or 2040 rolls around, things will mostly look the same. Some changes, but mostly the same. Materially that is.

Yes automation will eliminate some jobs, but why wouldn't the natural reaction to that be for women to return to being homemakers? Women have a role in the home that doesn't require employment. If there are fewer employed positions to give to people, then the logical next step is to have women go back to fulfilling they used to fill but now is done half assed because corporations want too much of her time and energy to make fulfilling that role be effective.

I'm talking about BOTH the past half century or so and the future (mid 21st century roughly). The last half century or so has shown us that rapid material progress can occur and indeed has occurred without traditionalism and despite sexual liberalism (this point isn't even controversial), which already completely undermines any notion that traditionalism is a pragmatic necessity in the modern world; and, additionally, the extent of future automation is predicted to be so great that it will completely disrupt the current way of life and render the vast majority of the current workforce obsolete in a short period of time. I'm talking about sudden change of apocalyptic proportions and society being completely turned upside down (certainly not something so minor as to be remedied with simple patchwork solutions and appeals to outdated tradcon ideas from the past).

While I don't blindly follow the predictions of scientists either, most of Ray Kurzweil's predictions about specific technological advancements which he made in the 90s have come true in subsequent decades with an uncanny degree of accuracy (I don't even agree with much of Kurzweil's philosophy but credit where credit's due), and the prognosis of a rapid evolution of robotics and AI in the next few decades doesn't seem to be incorrect at all. In just the first quarter of the 21st century the level of technological advancement has been phenomenal. Just compare what people have today compared to what we had in the late 90s. Even greater technological leaps will certainly take place in the second quarter of the 21st century since the trajectory of technological progress is exponential. The next phase of development of robotics and AI will undoubtedly dwarf that of the last two decades by magnitudes. Then what about the period between 2050 and 2100? If technological advancement hasn't been interrupted by some unforeseen disaster, we're talking about developments that will look "sci-fi" by our current standards. The theme of the 21st century is technological revolution and the upheavals that will inevitably result from that.

Now, once automation has reached the level of development that Kurzweil predicts it to reach in the mid 2040s, it will no longer make sense to justify the current system of labor since robotics and AI will be able to do most industrial operations much more efficiently than any human could ever do. Most beta provider types (sorry to use these "RedPill" terms but I think that they're the most understandable choice of terminology on a forum like this) will become completely obsolete from a labor perspective. Most modern career women will likewise become completely obsolete at the same time regardless of feminism. All that will be needed for civilization to be maintained and continue to advance will be a relatively small population of people with technical knowledge and certain specific skills for non-automatable tasks, and even then, their workload will likely be considerably smaller than that of most people today. Needless to say, high birthrates will not be necessary at all, and traditional notions of monogamy will be even less relevant than they are in our current time.

The technological developments which I have described will even result in the obsolescence of the capitalist economic arrangement (even though capitalism undeniably drove so much of this technological progress) and the next logical step will be some form of techno-socialism given the erosion of the labor system through automation and the superior production capacity that will result from future advanced technologies. The current global elite (New World Order) knows all of this and wishes to implement its own techno-socialist system in the form of the "Great Reset" while simultaneously retaining and consolidating its own power and monopoly on material resources. I am extremely perturbed by their agenda since those (((psychopaths))) are hellbent on enslaving and destroying Gentile humanity due to their own perverse Talmudic vision and will even use progress (including real instances thereof) for our enslavement and destruction. In light of this, conscious Gentiles must form our own governments and competing elite and militarily fight to topple the New World Order. I'm sure that the smarter readers will be able to read between the lines.

Should such a Gentile resistance movement succeed in its desire to overthrow the NWO, we will still have the problem of the obsolescence of the current capitalist economic arrangement in light of 21st century technological advancement and automation. We will therefore have to design our own Gentile form of techno-socialism using material progress and technology intelligently for the wellbeing and betterment of our people rather than for our enslavement or destruction. I myself don't see this as a catastrophe. I'm not really a fan of today's cutthroat capitalism which is nothing more than a Jew-run plutocratic crypto-dictatorship anyway. My own ideas with regard to ideal governance are more in line with national socialism, at least in terms of political theory. For me the destruction of today's Jew-run plutocratic capitalism and the global elite's Jew communism alike would be an extremely positive development since it would allow us to develop our own better social and economic systems based on the intelligent use of technology and science and aimed at true progress, free from the shackles of the current (((elite))).

I know that I've had a @WilliamSmith moment and gone off on the Jews with my long digression about future political systems and the need to resist the New World Order, but my point is that traditional marriage hasn't been necessary from a pragmatic standpoint for well over half a century and certainly won't be in the mid 21st century either given predicted technological trends, barring an unforeseen planetary natural or human catastrophe severe enough to undo material progress as Marcos mentioned. At the current rate I only foresee traditionalism remaining pragmatically obsolete (except as an optional lifestyle choice for those who want it for personal reasons) and beta provider masculinity losing even more currency than it already has done up until now. Guys, the writing is on the wall. If you want a woman, you've gotta develop sources of attraction other than a good paycheck and learn dating skills, even if you don't end up acting like a volatile ape-like gangbanger (which is not even what real alpha masculinity is anyway).

Would you agree that resentment and anger towards sexual liberalism is more intense now then it was, say, 10 or 15 years ago? The same thing is going to happen with all liberal/feminist values.

No, I've not seen much resentment towards sexual liberalism at all, only towards feminism. Most people who I have known in the UK and Spain (the two countries which I know the most intimately) have no interest in traditionalism or puritanism and tend to regard them as outdated value systems from the dark ages. Moreover, tradcons and puritans are widely stereotyped as uptight prudes. Even Spanish Catholics (nominal) think this.

I agree that there will be strong backlash against "wokeism" and the liberal left, but not against sexual liberalism since it's just so hard to convince guys not to fcuk multiple women, especially in a secular age and without Jewdeo-Christian slave religions with bizarre oppressive teachings of "hellfire and brimstone".

A true traditional society has much more opportunities and benefits to living in it then simply living a traditional life in a right-leaning liberal society or even a center-right, conservative society like Japan currently is. The benefits to a true traditional society are enormous.

Like what? Just being tied down to one wife through socially enforced monogamy and being told how to live by sanctimonious tradcon assholes?

If Japan is your model for a traditional society with opportunities and benefits, then it's a hard sell to somebody like me who views Japan with its morbid workaholic beta provider masculinity culture as an absolute dystopia. Yeah, benefits like being a worked-to-death beta drone tied down to one woman and with all other sexual strategies demonized.

I'm afraid that I'm going to have to reluctantly agree with @CaptainSkelebob (even though he does come across as a bit of a douchebag): today's tradcons mostly consist of reactionary sexually frustrated betas who are not very good at competing with other more desirable males and like to fantasize about how some idealized traditionalist regime or authoritarian theocracy will lay down the law and provide every tradcon beta male with his own wholesome tradwife. Tradcon societies only benefit sexually undesirable betas.

I said it myself too: the beta provider masculinists who seek to make earnings and professional status the be-all end-all of sexual selection (like in Japanese society) and simultaneously demonize or discredit other strategies of attraction simply wish to cunningly shift the rules of the sexual market in their own favor and put a cap on all other forms of competition. It's just an attempt at a power grab on their part in my estimation! Of course, those beta provider masculinists will argue that their virtue is "hard work" and that they therefore deserve the most attractive females because of their salaries, but again we come full circle to the topic of high technology and automation which reduce the currency of beta provider masculinity and will one day make it obsolete. Besides most beta provider types aren't rare pioneers or innovators anyway; most of them simply do unremarkable menial tasks which will be among the first things to be automated.

I'm not trying to hate on that kind of guy, by the way. I'm just calling it as I see it.

Just arguing my point that traditionalism has been obsolete for well over half a century and will more than likely remain that way and that beta provider masculinity is increasingly in an obsolescent state.

[CaptainSkelebob]

Good stuff!!!
Very well put WilliamSmith and hilarious
There is some unknown evil associated with banging women that @Outcast9428 has failed to clarify....
Other than what he decides is morally acceptable...
Thats what his whole beef with me was about in the first place
In my opinion I think hes just a jealous beta
A marxist of the sexual market who fears competition from bad ass alphas!!
Banging women is my passion!! I just absolutely love it!
I dont see why enjoying banging women makes a man a degenerate???
Its just doing what is natural
If these betas dont like doing what is natural as a man they could always identify as a woman instead

I think @Outcast9428 has his heart's in the right place and he's trying to be protective (hey, I'm also angry about homosexual pedophiles being allowed to after innocent little children too ,and want to put a stop to that outrage, so Outcast and I have some kind of common ground on some things), but I can't help agreeing here about him seeing "some unknown evil associated with banging women that @Outcast9428 has failed to clarify...."

He's got some highly specific idealized notions about having a zillion rules, some of which I cannot agree on. I've been trying to argue that women love getting their brains screwed out and if anything those of us who actually have the fire in us to give the ladies what they want is healthy for society so the women don't turn into neurotic sex-starved screwballs with mental and physical problems when they're not getting enough dick, and that giving the women what they want is not some form of "degeneracy" tearing down a healthy society, but I can't get through to him on it, so I guess I'll just have to go on banging women and not worrying about it. After all, true heroism and masculinity require we go driving forward at full speed doing what we know is the right thing regardless of whether we're opposed by others, and following our own code, even if some tradpill betas don't understand the wholesome and valuable thing we're doing by giving the women a good healthy screwing.

In another thread he even was yelling at us that giving a woman with a big ass and nice solid spanking was supposedly "degeneracy," because it was a simulated "act of violence" against women that was supposedly going to cause women to lose their marbles and get on autopilot to undermine and destroy all that is holy.
I tried to explain that the girls just like getting their big butts spanked and it gets them excited and turned on and makes them squeal, and they describe it sending a tingling sensation down into their pussies that excites them and gets them horny as hell. As I'm sure you, Lucas88, and many others here are already well aware, women also love getting their big asses spanked when you're giving them a good pounding from behind doggystyle, but he also tried to say that doing it doggy was in itself "mildly degenerate," LOL.
Like hell it is, I say, but that's fine, he can sleep on a cold stone floor to atone for original sin (or maybe do a slow, romantic and gentle lovemaking session with one Asian women at a time) while I get the big girls on all fours and give them the good hard pounding from behind they love so much while I spank their asses and get a nice good grip on their long hair (which they also like).

cringe as f**k
He thinks everything is degeneracy other than what he finds morally acceptable....
Its not degenerate to do these things at all!!!
Women do love a good smack on the butt when ur giving it to them. Ur absolutely right
I made some flippent comment a while ago about becoming traditional a little myself
Outcast has hated me ever since I said I would bang women even if I got my ideal Thai bride
I dont play by the rules and he doesnt like that someone has the balls to take what they want from life
All I want from life are 2 things
1 My perfect Thai bride.
2 all the vagina my weapon of mass destruction comes across!
Ive already become successful financially because I dont play by the rules
These skirt wearing betas who rant about traditionalism and bitch about alphas and accuse them of lying
How f***ing jealous can these fellas be
Their values are weak
It is an ideology for beta men so they can all go to work with big smiles on their faces while their wife is at home banging her tennis instructor....

[CaptainSkelebob]

It's funny how I've been posting this stuff for months and it's only now that you pussies waited until you can all be in your little faggot clique to talk shit. You are all privileged little cunts who can't handle the truth about reality which is why my posts trigger you faggots so much. None of you are alphas, none of you understand women. Go argue about "toxic masculinity" and other feminist bullshit some more if you want while I f**k a bitch in my RV.

Time of the month???
If you cant handle the heat you shouldnt be dancing in the fire
And if you lay one hand on that dog I will report you to the police

[CaptainSkelebob]

There's not a single alpha male in this thread, by the way. The only man on this site who has provided pictures of himself with women is Winston. You rest of the posters here are larping faggots who get no women. No one who actually gets women has enough time to post giant walls of text about being an alpha male online. Not to mention even if you do get women it's not even a skill, it's just based off genetics (luck) anyway so it's not an accomplishment. You're also a bluepilled faggot if you base your self worth around whether women like you or not since real alphas knows what shallow creatures they are.

Hahahah, but you can't stop us:
This little jew Mercer so shrewdly saw through us fake alphas here (wow, you YHWH's Chosen are SO smart and clever, you see right through us goys when we try to get in on your tribe's game of telling endless lies, but it seems we just can't beat you at your own game, since it's in your blood to tell endless lies, but not ours).
But we posers here claiming we have internet businesses that generate some passive income (hence abnormal amounts of free time for the likes of expat research and thought-provoking longwinded discussion with interesting personalities like @Outcast9428, @Lucas88, @Pixel--dude, @gsjackson, and many more) and claim we like having sex are actually "fake Alpha males" who have never touched a woman in our life, and are "ruining the forum" with all our posing and larping since we have so much extra time on our hands livin' in Grandma's basement.
The delicious irony that I'd have expected even a jew to appreciate is that there's nothing you can do to stop us for exactly that reason: You fuckin' ugly little yiddish manginas have to go get kicked around at work in your jobs even if you pick up a little side income trolling for the Mossad or other jewish groups on HA and social media, even though you claim it's supposedly absolutely impossible to get any women in "Anglo" societies even if you have money. So while you suckers grind on that with only time for a few shitposts, I stay at home trolling Happier Abroad with all the time in the world on my hands, and Grandma takes care of all the bills so I don't even have to work at all, even though it's kind of a PIA if I go upstairs to microwave the food and she starts screaming at me to get a job and a girlfriend (but NBD since I can just wait until the old nag is asleep or watching professional wrestling at high volume on TV and sneak upstairs then so she doesn't notice me).

Anyway, he got me: I got bored talkin' shit on Discord and Instagram or whatever they're called about first-person shooters and anime, so I decided to join this forum and pose as a 41 year-old sexaholic alcoholic virulently antisemitic homophobic Anglo male who loves Black women (also Asian women, Latinas, etc, just not as much as Black women) and wants to move aboard a boat fulltime.

Tragic, really, that we're allowed on here to "ruin the forum" as fake alpha males: Just think what a wonderful productive place this forum would be if only brief posts were allowed to fill the forum with explosively high value threads like:
"PUA is a scam"
"Self-improvement is a scam"
"It's impossible to start your own business"
"It's impossible to save money"
"It's impossible to give women orgasms"
"Physical fitness is a scam"
"Nutrition is a scam"
"Martials arts are a scam and none of them work"
"It's impossible to trade stocks and the system is rigged so there's absolutely no way to make a profit on any trades, but even so it has nothing to do with jews"
"It's impossible to be attractive or get along with anyone anywhere, because it's all based on your genetics and there's nothing any one can do to improve this or anything else"
"It's impossible for anyone except born Chads with looks of steel to get a girlfriend"
"Asian men are only valued for money"
"No women anywhere in the world find Anglo men attractive"
"It's impossible for Black men to get laid anywhere in the world, especially not with White or Japanese sports and/or hiphop fanatic Gaijin hunters"
"Latinas don't like sex"
"Anglo women have no interest in sex and have infinite power over everything"
"Women have all the power in Western society, and the collapse of the West has nothing to do with jews"
"It's impossible to succeed at anything, ever"
etc
etc

But even now you exposed us, we don't even give a f**k now that you exposed us all as Rick Moranis look-alikes living in Grandma's basement and talking shit, because like that jewish swamp rat fschmidt says: We're all "complete morons" who "deserve to be executed."
So there's literally nothing you can do about us, since you yourselves are actually powerless, even though you welded your schizophrenic anti-gentile tribal deity into a perverse fusion with Zeus and "God the Creator" and shit and have got the delusion into your warped twisted minds that you're the "Chosen people" destined to rule the world even though everyone on it rightly despises you. Hah, all you can do is cry about if you f***ing little rats, hahah! I can't wait to watch the jihadis f***ing slaughter you after your anglocuck and euro warslaves are out of the picture since you wiped them out of their own sorry ass countries and killed your own golden goose who fought two world wars and a bazillion zionist forever wars for you, but without them to use as your wardogs and human shields, now you'll all get the brutal f***ing total bloody slaughtering you so truly and thoroughly deserve.

Tsar always suspected this guy of being a troll or someone's sock puppet. I can't say I've had too much to do with him though. Is this the guy who made a thread about you @WilliamSmith? Something about you being the reason none of us can get any women? So what is it @Mercer? Is @WilliamSmith someone who is so alpha he gets all the women and doesn't leave enough for the rest of us? Or is he a fake alpha who's never seen the world beyond his bedroom?

Personally, I'm inclined to believe you are as alpha as you come across. What was it Skelebob called you? A pussyologist I suspect what Skelebob says about Mercer might hold some truth, since Mercer seems to enjoy calling you out. Maybe he likes the attention.

I do believe there is more nuance in things and the type of alpha masculinity that constitutes your character is compatible with manners and gentlemanly behaviours. Whereas @CaptainSkelebob behaves in a way that all women seem to label as toxic masculinity. I'm not judging by the way, just making an honest observation. It does seem to me to be a paradox that someone who treats women like pieces of meat, as opposed to treating them like women, can "bang over 100 women" and have kids littered all over the place

Also to address what @Outcast9428 said about masculinity, I do think alpha males who enjoy banging women can also be chivalrous and gentlemanly and charismatic and also good people. There seems to be some erroneous correlation in general with alpha males and "toxic masculinity". The traits you mentioned for healthy masculinity and toxic masculinity are not mutually exclusive.

No PD I did not say that
When I approach women I always act gentlemenly
Women dont see my masculinity as toxic
They see my masculinity as attractive
Otherwise how have I nailed so many of them
You might be happy living as a beta provider but the life I want is one where I can bring hot babes back to my house and bang them
And I dont know if I have kids out there
Maybe I do.
But I'm not the paternal type and if they want to meet me then they can find me when they turn 18
If they can survive that long
The strong will survive and succeed

[CaptainSkelebob]

I feel like you basically ignored every point that I made. I'm not talking about the past 50 years, I'm talking about this future you are mentioning. First of all, scientists tend to predict these enormous, sweeping changes by really early years, and just like the whole "all the oil will run out by the year 2000" stuff that baby boomers heard back in the 70s, it doesn't come true. People in the 80s thought we'd be in flying cars by now. I'm willing to bet, by the time 2030 or 2040 rolls around, things will mostly look the same. Some changes, but mostly the same. Materially that is.

Yes automation will eliminate some jobs, but why wouldn't the natural reaction to that be for women to return to being homemakers? Women have a role in the home that doesn't require employment. If there are fewer employed positions to give to people, then the logical next step is to have women go back to fulfilling they used to fill but now is done half assed because corporations want too much of her time and energy to make fulfilling that role be effective.

I'm talking about BOTH the past half century or so and the future (mid 21st century roughly). The last half century or so has shown us that rapid material progress can occur and indeed has occurred without traditionalism and despite sexual liberalism (this point isn't even controversial), which already completely undermines any notion that traditionalism is a pragmatic necessity in the modern world; and, additionally, the extent of future automation is predicted to be so great that it will completely disrupt the current way of life and render the vast majority of the current workforce obsolete in a short period of time. I'm talking about sudden change of apocalyptic proportions and society being completely turned upside down (certainly not something so minor as to be remedied with simple patchwork solutions and appeals to outdated tradcon ideas from the past).

While I don't blindly follow the predictions of scientists either, most of Ray Kurzweil's predictions about specific technological advancements which he made in the 90s have come true in subsequent decades with an uncanny degree of accuracy (I don't even agree with much of Kurzweil's philosophy but credit where credit's due), and the prognosis of a rapid evolution of robotics and AI in the next few decades doesn't seem to be incorrect at all. In just the first quarter of the 21st century the level of technological advancement has been phenomenal. Just compare what people have today compared to what we had in the late 90s. Even greater technological leaps will certainly take place in the second quarter of the 21st century since the trajectory of technological progress is exponential. The next phase of development of robotics and AI will undoubtedly dwarf that of the last two decades by magnitudes. Then what about the period between 2050 and 2100? If technological advancement hasn't been interrupted by some unforeseen disaster, we're talking about developments that will look "sci-fi" by our current standards. The theme of the 21st century is technological revolution and the upheavals that will inevitably result from that.

Now, once automation has reached the level of development that Kurzweil predicts it to reach in the mid 2040s, it will no longer make sense to justify the current system of labor since robotics and AI will be able to do most industrial operations much more efficiently than any human could ever do. Most beta provider types (sorry to use these "RedPill" terms but I think that they're the most understandable choice of terminology on a forum like this) will become completely obsolete from a labor perspective. Most modern career women will likewise become completely obsolete at the same time regardless of feminism. All that will be needed for civilization to be maintained and continue to advance will be a relatively small population of people with technical knowledge and certain specific skills for non-automatable tasks, and even then, their workload will likely be considerably smaller than that of most people today. Needless to say, high birthrates will not be necessary at all, and traditional notions of monogamy will be even less relevant than they are in our current time.

The technological developments which I have described will even result in the obsolescence of the capitalist economic arrangement (even though capitalism undeniably drove so much of this technological progress) and the next logical step will be some form of techno-socialism given the erosion of the labor system through automation and the superior production capacity that will result from future advanced technologies. The current global elite (New World Order) knows all of this and wishes to implement its own techno-socialist system in the form of the "Great Reset" while simultaneously retaining and consolidating its own power and monopoly on material resources. I am extremely perturbed by their agenda since those (((psychopaths))) are hellbent on enslaving and destroying Gentile humanity due to their own perverse Talmudic vision and will even use progress (including real instances thereof) for our enslavement and destruction. In light of this, conscious Gentiles must form our own governments and competing elite and militarily fight to topple the New World Order. I'm sure that the smarter readers will be able to read between the lines.

Should such a Gentile resistance movement succeed in its desire to overthrow the NWO, we will still have the problem of the obsolescence of the current capitalist economic arrangement in light of 21st century technological advancement and automation. We will therefore have to design our own Gentile form of techno-socialism using material progress and technology intelligently for the wellbeing and betterment of our people rather than for our enslavement or destruction. I myself don't see this as a catastrophe. I'm not really a fan of today's cutthroat capitalism which is nothing more than a Jew-run plutocratic crypto-dictatorship anyway. My own ideas with regard to ideal governance are more in line with national socialism, at least in terms of political theory. For me the destruction of today's Jew-run plutocratic capitalism and the global elite's Jew communism alike would be an extremely positive development since it would allow us to develop our own better social and economic systems based on the intelligent use of technology and science and aimed at true progress, free from the shackles of the current (((elite))).

I know that I've had a @WilliamSmith moment and gone off on the Jews with my long digression about future political systems and the need to resist the New World Order, but my point is that traditional marriage hasn't been necessary from a pragmatic standpoint for well over half a century and certainly won't be in the mid 21st century either given predicted technological trends, barring an unforeseen planetary natural or human catastrophe severe enough to undo material progress as Marcos mentioned. At the current rate I only foresee traditionalism remaining pragmatically obsolete (except as an optional lifestyle choice for those who want it for personal reasons) and beta provider masculinity losing even more currency than it already has done up until now. Guys, the writing is on the wall. If you want a woman, you've gotta develop sources of attraction other than a good paycheck and learn dating skills, even if you don't end up acting like a volatile ape-like gangbanger (which is not even what real alpha masculinity is anyway).

Would you agree that resentment and anger towards sexual liberalism is more intense now then it was, say, 10 or 15 years ago? The same thing is going to happen with all liberal/feminist values.

No, I've not seen much resentment towards sexual liberalism at all, only towards feminism. Most people who I have known in the UK and Spain (the two countries which I know the most intimately) have no interest in traditionalism or puritanism and tend to regard them as outdated value systems from the dark ages. Moreover, tradcons and puritans are widely stereotyped as uptight prudes. Even Spanish Catholics (nominal) think this.

I agree that there will be strong backlash against "wokeism" and the liberal left, but not against sexual liberalism since it's just so hard to convince guys not to fcuk multiple women, especially in a secular age and without Jewdeo-Christian slave religions with bizarre oppressive teachings of "hellfire and brimstone".

A true traditional society has much more opportunities and benefits to living in it then simply living a traditional life in a right-leaning liberal society or even a center-right, conservative society like Japan currently is. The benefits to a true traditional society are enormous.

Like what? Just being tied down to one wife through socially enforced monogamy and being told how to live by sanctimonious tradcon assholes?

If Japan is your model for a traditional society with opportunities and benefits, then it's a hard sell to somebody like me who views Japan with its morbid workaholic beta provider masculinity culture as an absolute dystopia. Yeah, benefits like being a worked-to-death beta drone tied down to one woman and with all other sexual strategies demonized.

I'm afraid that I'm going to have to reluctantly agree with @CaptainSkelebob (even though he does come across as a bit of a douchebag): today's tradcons mostly consist of reactionary sexually frustrated betas who are not very good at competing with other more desirable males and like to fantasize about how some idealized traditionalist regime or authoritarian theocracy will lay down the law and provide every tradcon beta male with his own wholesome tradwife. Tradcon societies only benefit sexually undesirable betas.

I said it myself too: the beta provider masculinists who seek to make earnings and professional status the be-all end-all of sexual selection (like in Japanese society) and simultaneously demonize or discredit other strategies of attraction simply wish to cunningly shift the rules of the sexual market in their own favor and put a cap on all other forms of competition. It's just an attempt at a power grab on their part in my estimation! Of course, those beta provider masculinists will argue that their virtue is "hard work" and that they therefore deserve the most attractive females because of their salaries, but again we come full circle to the topic of high technology and automation which reduce the currency of beta provider masculinity and will one day make it obsolete. Besides most beta provider types aren't rare pioneers or innovators anyway; most of them simply do unremarkable menial tasks which will be among the first things to be automated.

I'm not trying to hate on that kind of guy, by the way. I'm just calling it as I see it.

Just arguing my point that traditionalism has been obsolete for well over half a century and will more than likely remain that way and that beta provider masculinity is increasingly in an obsolescent state.

I come across as a douche because nobody gets me
Those who accuse me of being a troll are all ppl who have an issue with me.
Because they are all jealous that Ive got huge manly balls and they have little faggot balls
But I said exactly the same!!
That traditionalists are weak feminized little faggots who are sexual communists.
They dont want to do anything to earn their p***y they just want it handed over
Women have already utilized technological advancements by getting themselfs a sex toy so they dont have to have shite sex with their beta husbands
I can't imagine anything more boring
If by some cruel twist of fate outcast ever did get his traditionalism prison world I would still bang women anyway